Bites: A fake Rolex as a signal of success?
Happy Tuesday Crunchers!
Today I want to talk about fake watches, symbols of success and why these little trinkets can mean so much to us, but there has been lots of fun stuff on WC to catch up on first.
Obviously, there is loads of chat at the moment regarding Watches and Wonders, so I will focus on the other excitement and watch releases of the past week which may have been missed.
I’ve slimmed down the ‘New Watches’ section because there are so many new releases I thought it would be a better if I just gave my favourite choices from the past week and you can catch up on all the others in the WC news section.
Also, as well as going to the London WC meet up on Friday I’m also off on holiday next week, so no Bites next Tuesday.
Now, lets see what’s been happening…
3 quick things to check out this week if you’re sort on time…
Catch up on the microbrand tournament and see who’s still in the race. I would just like to point out that my early prediction of a Baltic vs AnOrdain final is still looking good.
Check out Volume I of what I really hope will be an ongoing deinfluencer series talking us out of watch buying ‘Don’t buy this watch’.
Hear what @Max has to say as he discusses the Milgauss in his latest video.
Plus... something to listen to on the move:
Analog Explorer Podcast: Episode 16 – Watches and Wondering Fellow crunchers @Analogexplorer and @Timely_moments chat about the MoonSwatch, Watches and Wonders and their SOTC.
Hungry for more? Check out the rest…
New members:
New members who I’ve seen posting this week… @Seungheon, @ashleytee, @gamesetwatch, @Huckle , @Canisterwatches , @Kalsota, @AdamJK, @SNWatchNerd, @Acetabular, @T.Time, @IBombAtomically, @birdwatch, @Antonio_alux, @DangusMagoo, @watch_drives_you, @Fluffhead
Weclome to WC!
Hot Posts:
This weeks topics that got the community talking…
Would you rather.. – @AnalogExplorer Puts our love of watches up against our other passions.
Help stop me from buying this watch – @ckim4watches askes for help in being disauded from a watch purchase… Does the community help..?
Traveling with your good watch – @Wiscfan23 Asks the community whether we should be travelling with the more precious pieces in our collections.
Meetups and Events:
31st March - London WatchCrunch Meetup: Part II – London, UK
27th April - 2nd March - Watches and Wonders 2023 - Geneva, Switzerland
1st April - WatchCrunch Meetup @ Watches and Wonders - Geneva, Switzerland
8th April Watch Crunch x Prosper meetup - Bruxelles, Belgium
28th – 30th April - Windup Watch Fair 2023 - San Francisco, CA
5th May - Cruise ship Meetup - New Jersey to UK
14th – 16th July - Windup Watch Fair 2023 - Chicago
20th – 22nd October - Windup Watch Fair 2023 – New York
Let me know if you hear of any other meetups and I’ll add them to our weekly calendar.
Big thanks to @DeepCmonkey for setting last weeks photography theme of ‘Fauna and Flora’. His top pic this week was @AnalogExplorer with this beauty….
Come see the runners up and find out the chosen theme for this weeks photos here, which has been kindly set by last weeks winner and this weeks guest judge @AnalogExplorer.
Here are some of the best new watch releases from the past week (outside of Watches and Wonders!).
If I hear about any new watch drops which I think people would like to know about before the next letter I will update this section.
Top row: Yema, Petermann Bedat, Furlan Marri
Second row Hamilton Wandering Earth, Carl F Bucherer, Longines Spirit Flyback
Third row: Omega, Rolling stones and Jaquet Droz, Doxa
Watches in the Wild – @Edge168n
A different type of episode from Edge this week as he talks about meeting up with a fellow Cruncher.
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Watches under the microscope: RZE and Seiko Turtle – @Nooski
Another look at some of our favourite watches up close and personal.
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Through the Porthole – @Porthole
A NWA and discussion for another lovely lesser known vintage watch brand.
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In praise of tropical dials: Love in the ruins– @Aurelian
A love letter to aged dials.
Can we talk about... “Your watch as a signal of success”
There is so much that unites us on WC, I sometimes forget the vast variety of backgrounds, cultures and walks of life we all come from. Even when we put aside the vast distance between most of us, there still remains the simple fact that many of our walks of life are so far removed from each other we likely would have never connected if it wasn't for this shared watch loving affliction.
This is a blessing and a curse.
On one hand the variety of our collective experience and perspectives helps bring richness and depth to this platform and our community.
On the other, opposing views on polarising topics can sometimes lead to conflict.
When discussions get heated I am the first to say “Its only watches! Calm down!”, however, on reflection, I think this may be an oversimplification.
@Aurelian makes no secret of his eye rolling when we talk about the 'watch journey' and has often commented that we watch folks are over romanticising our bauble hoarding in a way that no other collectors do.
But watches are unlike many other collections.
Because of their crossover with art and fashion they are more a reflection of ourselves, our personalities and moods, than other types of collections.
Getting to know and understand ourselves, even something as simple our likes and dislikes, how we want to present ourselves externally, is a process... a journey... which can be reflected in our watch choices.
Even for those of us who claim independence from influence, "I just buy what I like", our choices are still a product of our upbringing, culture and personal circumstances.
This is the reason why sometimes it's not 'just watches', but an insight into something more.
Every now and then we will get a glimpse of what watches mean in another person's world.
@HotWatchChick69 has spoken about the idea of 'not being rich enough to buy cheap things' and I wonder also if the fiery views that can exist around Rolex, the MoonSwatch and homages, for example, are more linked to what these represent in terms of our perceptions of pretentiousness, fairness and honesty.
A recent Time and Tide article talked about how Ryan Serhant, an incredibly successful real estate broker in the US, attributed much of his success to wearing a fake Rolex. He spoke about how Rolex was seen as the marker of success in his field, and so wearing one had the effect of changing client’s perceptions of him and also his perception of himself.
Fake it till you make it.
Yet in another recent article in the UK newspaper The Times, ‘Servants, Yachts and Rolex selfies’, the leaders of a recruitment agency that provides workers to the UK NHS (National Health Service) are maligned for flaunting their Rolex Daytonas.
It wouldn't make the slightest bit of difference which watch I wore at work, in terms of people’s perception of me (which is lucky, considering some of the questionable pieces in my collection) though an expensive watch would be in poor taste when I’m working in the more deprived areas. However, the area I live and work is more farming, factories and ex-coal mining communities rather than banking, hedge funds and bitcoin, so what a watch means here is going to be much different to what it means elsewhere.
'Looking the part' and gaining people’s trust around here happens to not involve a watch, but I can appreciate it may for those of us in the cities, in other areas of business or in other walks of life.
If wearing a particular watch DID mean I was trusted more in my field of work, honestly, I probably would wear one.
What do watches mean in your work/community?
Do people care what's on your wrist?
Is a watch a marker of success for you, either externally or internally?
Take care folks and see you in a fortnight!
Kaysia
Banner photo: A beautiful photograph from @Juanluisgarcia posted in the photography club thread a few weeks ago (not a fake watch!). We have so many beautiful photographs in the club threads now, I’m going to try and show more of them off.
Part-time 'writter' @ The Escapement Room, the NSFW watch enthusiasts blog. www.theescapementroom.com/
More from DeeperBlue
Another great read, have a great holiday!!
Another great read, have a great holiday!!
Thank you!
Meetup first on Friday and I'll try to post pictures from that before I go. ✈
Enjoy your time off!
Enjoy your time off!
Thank you! Looking forward to it 🎉
another awesome article! Thank you.
another awesome article! Thank you.
Thank you for your kind words! Glad you enjoyed 🍻
@Deeperblue thanks for sharing the joint ZT Podcast & AE Podcast episode! @AnalogExplorer
I think you nailed it in your Editor's Thoughts section. We all come from very different backgrounds, and cultures, so we all see the world from very different perspectives.
It can be easy to forget that what is normal in one culture/sub-culture, might be considered rude or ridiculous in another.
I was born and raised in a fishing village, in Canada's smallest province. A flashy gold or two tone Rolex would have been laughed at, while at the same time a flashy truck was considered a reasonable sign of success.
Thank you! Looking forward to it 🎉
Kids are on "Spring Break" in Virginia so we'll be doing the same thing
Great read Kaysia, thank you. In response to your question about watches as a sign of success I have to say that in my albeit limited experience of wearing watches, not one single person has ever commented on them. They go by unnoticed by the masses. In fact, I literally have to shove a new watch under the noses of friends or family if I want to see what they think about it. I do not however live or work in an area or career where what I wear is seen as important. In fact, I am far more likely to be judged for succumbing to consumerism than anything else!
I think you nailed it in your Editor's Thoughts section. We all come from very different backgrounds, and cultures, so we all see the world from very different perspectives.
It can be easy to forget that what is normal in one culture/sub-culture, might be considered rude or ridiculous in another.
I was born and raised in a fishing village, in Canada's smallest province. A flashy gold or two tone Rolex would have been laughed at, while at the same time a flashy truck was considered a reasonable sign of success.
Seeing a lot of this “if it’s not in my worldview then it must be wrong” sort of attitude in reaction to Marcon’s $2.5k Bell & Ross and that the typical person doesn’t spend that much on a watch . . . Of course, the typical person might have zero qualms spending that much on other things and their culture and community wouldn’t bat an eye.
Anytime displays of wealthy status symbols cross into the realm of the public's collective monies this is going to result in "How is there that much money in the system that a public servant can afford that?"
I'm all for paying people proper wages, but those people also need to consider the optics of some of their choices. The complainers also need to consider that maybe the public servant married into money or is really good with their money and that display of wealth is really a one time splurge.
Lovely way to start my day with this round-up and watch musing. If I’m super honest with myself I have to admit that my current and future collection is, in part, influenced to a degree by my background (Scholarship kid from Silicon Valley) and my field (volleying between academia and the arts/NYC and London publishing worlds). There’s certainly some wealth and some nice watches from colleagues and those far more famous than I am . . . But there’s also a lot of people struggling in the creative trenches and there’s this unspoken sense of not flaunting too much. I think for this reason I’ve always gravitated toward luxury (or even just nice experiments that aren’t luxury) that’s more understated or closely tied to one indie designer or obviously appreciated and yet not ostentatious (like a lot of Grand Seiko). Yes, maybe I am rooting for AnOrdain in the match up 😂 Here I am rocking a Studio Underd0g mint chip at a book signing.
There's been a massive cultural change in the last 40 or so years in the work place, you wore a certain type of watch to designate position in the hierarchy of the the company or to designate what profession you were in, not so much nowadays,the rules have not just been broken but smashed. And then there's the rise of the gadget gizmo watch(smart thingy) that is probably now the most worn watch at work. Well it is at my place of work,which is quite surprising given the industrial nature of the job, it used to be just cheap watches,digital or mechanical something that didn't matter if it got battered.
As for my locale,it's a mixture of social classes. But hardly ever see anything interesting, I do know one guy who's mate collects Rolex's and has even got the daytona rainbow(begging him for an introduction, not that I really like the things but it would be nice to see one in the flesh just out of interest). A few now are interested as they know I'm into the things and as for success yeah, I do wear my disposable income and proud of my 'success' in a way,after all I've put the hours in(when the world's asleep I'm not) so yes it's a nice reward (and an interesting one).
Thanks for another thought provoking post and I'll see you tomorrow (and I'll be wearing something that I think will "float your boat"
What do watches mean in your work/community?
Absolutely nothing.
Do people care what's on your wrist?
Nobody notices or cares.
Is a watch a marker of success for you, either externally or internally?
No. They are just things that I like and I am fortunate to have models that I enjoy looking at and wearing.
As always thought provoking discussion Kaysia. I would buy a watch not to impress people but what caught my eye. Would get a few compliments. I was a director in a hospital years ago and really didn't need to impress someone. So that said and you might remember my usual answer lol "Retired". Don't care lol but understand the need to adapt to your environment and what's on the wrist.
❤ that⌚️!
Love your time and effort in your Bites as always!
Thank you
🍻
Thank you for your kind words 🙏🍻
Can't wait till I'm retired 😆
Hi, I just stumbled across your article. Great read, I'll certainly be following your content 👍
Thank you for kind comment! Glad you enjoyed 🍻
Thanks for another great post and for your keen insights.
Always a pleasure to read.
As I sit here getting ready for another day in Geneva and spending time with CEOs and executives of various watch brands, I realize how disconnected this is from others’ daily lives.
Makes one think hard about the time devoted to this hobby/affliction.
Quite honestly I enjoy the online camaraderie of WatchCrunchers more than all this folderal at Watches & Wonders.
I've never been to a big event like Watches and wonders.
What are the people like?
Is it a bit elitist??
I've met microbrand owners before, and that was a lovely experience, but not reps from bigger brands.
Thanks Kaysia @Deeperblue , have a lovely holiday!
Re - your Q’s
I work in a large trauma hospital with cardiac surgeons and ICU intensivists.
Watches mean nothing at work.
Most don’t wear, or care. Of course there are several Rolexes that I see occasionally, but I’m the only watch collector I know of. Those Rolex owners aren’t remotely ‘watch guys’ however. Very much the type that might argue their sea dweller is a submariner (a shocking scene once actually experienced by @Edge168n ).
Wearing a cool, beautiful and or meaningful watch makes me feel good, so yup, some internal benefits there. ☺
But can never think of in terms of a watch as “a mark of success” sounds like such a sad way to define success IMO
I work in community health care, and watches don't mean anything in my circles either. 🍻
Same. Third worlder here. Success means a personal car (doesn’t matter what kind. The important thing is that it’s new and you don’t have to use public transportation), house (rented or owned, doesn’t matter. Do you have more than 1 room? Okay, you’re successful), clothes (do you actually have more than 3 pairs? Success), and jewelry for women and watches for men (doesn’t actually matter what brand as long as it’s considered “luxury” but Rolex takes the top spot). Signals of success like wearing a watch nets you respect and reverence from the masses. I know this is all sorts of wrong but don’t blame me, blame society.
Thank you for sharing insights from where you are. I'd like to think this helps us all understand eachother a little better 🍻
A great article. Love the argument about fake Rolexes (some people actually call them 'decoys'). I would never recommend a person to buy something fake. The more you love it, the more you would start to wonder whether you would love the genuine timepiece if you had it.
These days, many of the people who buy them are simply buying it purely for themselves. Most know well not to flaunt it especially when their income doesn't match their lifestyle. But why are we ok when a wealthy person buys a fake Rolex? I mean it comes to a point that they would even announce that they wore a fake Rolex. The debate will continue on. As for me, I wouldn't really care if a person was wearing a fake or not, as long as they don't start waving it in front of my face. 😊
Yes, I'm developing a 'live and let live' attitude to everyone's watch choices, including fakes.
I'm so glad that true watch people understand that watch choice isn't a reflection of character. 🍻
Exactly it’s about the watch!
Original, Clone or homage and brand new or old they’re fascinating to me and if your fortunate to have the resources to buy some of the more intricate/complicated and hand made models then great but I would never evaluate a person or their circumstances by the watch they’re wearing. Have a great holiday!
Cool article as always. 😎
What do watches mean in your work/community? Nothing much. It's usually a tool for work or a fashion piece to match the occasion. Majority are not too conscious about brands. If they like what they see, and it's cheap, and is versatile enough to wear in many situations, they go for that. Ironically, when people buy a "status" watch, they get the Apple watch as it is expensive, while still being a practical tool.
Do people care what's on your wrist? Not really. Same as above.
Is a watch a marker of success for you, either externally or internally? No. I get what I like and enjoy wearing them.
This is interesting!
I guess that's probably similar around here when I think about it. People recognise Rolexes and Apple watches and that's about it.
Exactly it’s about the watch!
Original, Clone or homage and brand new or old they’re fascinating to me and if your fortunate to have the resources to buy some of the more intricate/complicated and hand made models then great but I would never evaluate a person or their circumstances by the watch they’re wearing. Have a great holiday!
Thank you! 🍻
I've never been to a big event like Watches and wonders.
What are the people like?
Is it a bit elitist??
I've met microbrand owners before, and that was a lovely experience, but not reps from bigger brands.
It’s very corporate. You are meeting senior executives and obviously top sales personnel. It feels like any number of business conventions I’ve been to over the years.
You can definitely OD from a visual standpoint on all of the watches and watch brands.
But they are looking for the five figure and six figure buyers.
Sort of a two tier system that is somewhat invisible unless you are on the inside.
Thank you for your kind words 🙏🍻
Can't wait till I'm retired 😆
It's always Friday night and Saturday morning. Where's my damn watch, geezer moment lol 🍷
It’s very corporate. You are meeting senior executives and obviously top sales personnel. It feels like any number of business conventions I’ve been to over the years.
You can definitely OD from a visual standpoint on all of the watches and watch brands.
But they are looking for the five figure and six figure buyers.
Sort of a two tier system that is somewhat invisible unless you are on the inside.
Thank you for the insight
The watch media makes W&W seem like a combo of Disneyland, Vegas, and a Luxury Watch Costco.
Nice to hear it’s more boring and corporate than we realize.
Is there some industry days and some public days?
If it’s always open to the public, does it get overrun by poors (like me), who want to look, try on, and take pictures (but not buy)?
Thank you for the insight
The watch media makes W&W seem like a combo of Disneyland, Vegas, and a Luxury Watch Costco.
Nice to hear it’s more boring and corporate than we realize.
Is there some industry days and some public days?
If it’s always open to the public, does it get overrun by poors (like me), who want to look, try on, and take pictures (but not buy)?
Great question.
Here’s how it runs…
Monday - Press Day - only exhibitors and press allowed together with celebrity ambassadors, etc
Tuesday - Friday - invitees only - primarily intended for generating sales to ADs and VIP customers of the brands. Everything is primarily by appointment, but you can wander the show and visit all the booths.
Saturday and Sunday - open to the public
I’m leaving tomorrow so won’t be able to report on the days open to the public. My guess is that it will be very crowded.
It’s fun to see all of the folks like Andrew from Time & Tide and Wei Koh from Revolution Watch walking the halls and running around town. Lots of private parties and dinners.
I don’t want it to sound like it’s a bad thing, just that it’s clear it’s all about selling watches.
Some truly amazing pieces to be seen. It will definitely challenge your mental capacity to be overwhelmed by all there is to offer.
Great question.
Here’s how it runs…
Monday - Press Day - only exhibitors and press allowed together with celebrity ambassadors, etc
Tuesday - Friday - invitees only - primarily intended for generating sales to ADs and VIP customers of the brands. Everything is primarily by appointment, but you can wander the show and visit all the booths.
Saturday and Sunday - open to the public
I’m leaving tomorrow so won’t be able to report on the days open to the public. My guess is that it will be very crowded.
It’s fun to see all of the folks like Andrew from Time & Tide and Wei Koh from Revolution Watch walking the halls and running around town. Lots of private parties and dinners.
I don’t want it to sound like it’s a bad thing, just that it’s clear it’s all about selling watches.
Some truly amazing pieces to be seen. It will definitely challenge your mental capacity to be overwhelmed by all there is to offer.
Ah ha, that makes sense.
Couldn’t imagine trying to do business surrounded by pushy or drooling watch otaku.
I’m enough of a horo nerd myself to be star struck if I was ever in attendance. Video from the show often has random famous people (well, famous watch people) in the background of shots. I expect the weekend will be more like Disneyland - the crowds and huge lines part.
While I can’t attend, at least l now virtually know one famous watch person: @ChronoGuy 😁🍺 cheers my friend!
A fake watch is a symbol of being a Jabroni