Alligator (and other animal) straps: how ethical?

Alligator tastes great deep fried AND makes for a lovely watch strap.

I don't have a problem with leather products because leather is a byproduct of the beef industry.  So many cows are raised for food that there are hides that go unused.  Very few cows are raised exclusively for the use of their hides.  It does not appear that the same is true for gator and other exotic skins used in fashion. I am fine with skins that would otherwise be wasted being used for straps, etc, but I don't like the idea of animals being farmed for their skin. 

https://rubberb.com swim skin might be a good alternative to non-animal based straps. But, for me nothing replaces a good calf/ostrich/alligator strap. 

My 2 cents on this is as follows:

When you stand outside in your garden, you might experience the peace and quiet, the butterflies, the squirrels, the birds, the calmness.. but just couple of inches under your feet there is a genocide going on. Big worms eating small worms, insects feasting on those worms, birds feasting on insects.. etc etc. Violence is natures way to recycle the old and make way for the new, the predator prey relationship is what keeps the balance on this planet. We humans are the ultimate predators, and we are smart enough no to be indiscriminate about how to harvest other animals. If you start associating other species with "human" yes it does become hard to harvest them for our needs, and you are better off calling a spade a spade. 

Gator meat is awesome, when battered and fried tastes just like chicken. 

Calf is the only one where I might care a little, as it's a calf! But how else do you get leather so supple and smooth-grained?

Well that and I feel that low grade leather, especially that reconstituted stuff, is a waste as it doesn't last at all. At least get a durable item of some quality from a hide.

I know nothing about eelskin, sharkskin, or  probably some other odder hides. I guess people somewhere eat the meat?

Appreciate your 2 cents, but this doesn't answer my question at all. 

I don't need anyone to analyze my relationship with animals. I've studied ethics and other philosophical questions, certainly a lot more than the majority of us here (including logic), and I can tell it has nothing to do with associating any sort of species with "human" (attribution bias).

Yeah... I've had a Cajun version when I've been in New Orleans a few times. Tastes great & I don't have a problem with most animals being raised for food.  From what I've read, some gator farms (not necessarily in the US) are raising gators and Crocs for skins and not using the meat.  I don't like that.

did u checkout the rubberB link I posted? That might be a good alternative, they do make alligator look alike. 

Never tasted gator, and am not against the idea, but let me highlight that this isn't really the question asked 😢

Durability is undoubtedly part of the equation, and I have similar expectations for synthetic straps or steel bracelets: I want to know as much as possible about the materials used and the different treatments a customer might be interested in.

Calf is the only one where I might care a little, as it's a calf!

What do you mean? what's the rationale behind that tautological statement?

As you say, it's so difficult/impossible to know what is actually going on behind the scenes, what practices are being followed and what phrases like 'ethically sourced' actually mean. For this reason I just feel better avoiding new leather altogether if I have a choice, however I feel ok buying leather straps secondhand as I don't feel that supports the industry and reusing straps is better than buying new in many ways. There are usually plenty of used straps on eBay.

This is just what works for me.

Ah yeah, sorry I missed that link; their SwimSkin technology looks impressive, indeed! Thanks for sharing. 

For some reason, though, it looks like folks assume I'm trying to avoid them altogether, while the core of my question was really to understand more about how all these gorgeous-looking hides are sourced – and decide from there. As pointed out in another comment, if I can keep a gator strap for 50 years or need to replace a cheap plastic one every year, I know where my decision would land.

To answer your question, there is no single answer. Each start manufacturer sources their leather from different tanneries so each manufacturer will score differently on the ethical question. 

If you see a particular brand you like, ask them about the tannery they use, and then look into where the tannery gets its leather. 

To my knowledge, the higher end strap manufacturers use farmed alligators for strap material, as the leather is a by-product of the alligator meat industry.  

I think it's a good discussion to have and would be interesting to investigate where your leather comes from. To this end I'd recommend custom straps from individuals that know where they're getting their products from. 

I avoid exotic leathers such as lizard or python, shark, etc, most of these animals are killed, have their hide stripped from them and the rest is discarded, whereas other animals such as cow, ostrich, alligator to an extent are consumed for other parts, even calf (veal), I don't know how this industry works exactly but I assume the animal processing plants sell the hide to tanneries which are in turn made into leather products, using most of the animal in most cases. Now it's up to you to decide if this is ethical or not.

I'm not into hunting any apex preditor.  I only hunt what I can eat. That translates to no Gaitor . Leather is OK. I like rubber and neoprene straps best for feel. Guess I'm not into hide straps 

As for alligators. There's people who would say that hunting them reduces harm because they are predators. 

I think that's a pretty deep conversation on philosophy and nature etc. 

But all that aside, most industries are largely farmed. Which means breeding and raising animals as cheaply as possible - and I think most would agree that is not great. 

lol k

This documentary is free to watch and explains a lot of it. 

https://www.dominionmovement.com/watch 

Narrated by Joaquin Phoenix and a few others. 

Yeah agreed. 

If it's not increasing demand for manufacturing then it's probably a good option. 

Though I often take a minute to consider if it actually does increase demand in certain situations. 

For example is increasing demand for items that are still in production because someone else now needs to get a new one - or by showing that it's fashionable to other guys who maybe aren't aware of the issues and then end up getting a new one.  

I am doing my best to get away from leather in general, but fall in line more with @MycroftTime's way of thinking. I have some basic leather straps, but leaving aligator, Ostrich, Roo, and others alone. 

I don’t have any issues with the tanning or fur industry raising animals for their hide. I just don’t. 🤷

I wish we were better at not driving species extinct, but the truth is that nature gives zero f**ks about you, me, or alligators. Nature is a rough place, and getting killed so a predator can survive is no nicer than getting killed so a human can have a pretty belt. I always think “free range” is comical…at least those chickens were happy right up until they‘re heads were pulled off so they could become nuggets. 
 

I’ll say that I don’t approve of “harvesting” animals to the point they ca‘t sustain their population. Keeping animals on farms so we can “use” them later, while kind of gruesome, is a different thing.  At least to me. 

A calf, to my understanding, is a prepubescent cow? It hasn't had anything resembling a full life, and has not reproduced. I'm sorry, this is so obvious to me that I'm having problems understanding the confusion.

Yep, calves are where veal comes from which is why I don't like thinking about what I eat or I'll turn VEGAN like my nieces ("it's not just cows, Uncle!").  I don't care what they say, I'd rather bury my head in the sand than give up fried chicken.  

Seriously, if I really think about it . . .     

It really doesn't pay to learn how the sausage is made (if you like sausage).

And if you take the analogy further...

Genesis 9:2-3...

"The fear and dread of you will fall on all the beasts of the earth, and on all the birds in the sky, on every creature that moves along the ground, and on all the fish in the sea; they are given into your hands. Everything that lives and moves about will be food for you. Just as I gave you the green plants, I now give you everything."

So I have no problem with wearing leather, alligator, ostrich or other animal products. I'm fine as long as the animals aren't tortured and are not killed for sport.

There is nothing like a beautiful alligator or crocodile strap for your watch...and you can find them for a wide range of prices.

I will try to address your initial inquiry without my usual snark. I live in a place where I have seen alligators while walking my dog or on my occasional canoeing excursions. Alligators are more common in the Southeastern United States than they have been been for a century. They have been been removed from our Endangered Species list. Every year states issue licenses to hunt alligators for a limited time to ensure that populations do not get too large.

In my part of the world it is a fairly regular occurrence to see large alligators on golf courses and sometimes on front porches. During hunting season local game processors do for hunters what they do for deer or wild pigs in those hunting seasons.

Alligators are not rare or in any danger of being hunted to extinction. I strongly suspect that their hides are used less in shoes, purses, and belts than previously. Fashions change. I see far fewer alligator watch straps than I did 30 or 40 years ago.

The tanning industry has never been held in high regard from what I can tell. Usually the chief complaint is pollution from discharge into rivers. So, your choices are the tanning industry, the mining industry (bracelets), or the petroleum industry (all manner of manufactured straps). All of these industries will place profit above some abstract altruistic good. I am sure that the major players in the watch strap business are opaque about their sourcing of material and environmental impact. I wouldn't be surprised if, especially in countries with little regulation, they aren't every bit as brutal and disgusting as meat packing.

If I had the ability I would only buy from small strap makers, like some that are on WC. The craftsman has the knowledge of where his material is sourced to be greater degree. Unfortunately, that is not economically feasible for most watches that we own. 

Many people that I respect do not use animal products of any sort for watch straps. I do and will in the future. I have no use for truly exotic straps, but I do not mourn an alligator. 

For small leather goods, such as watch straps, belts, wallets, etc , I try to only buy from places that specify the tannery they source their leather from. To me, transparency is a sign of quality and hopefully ethics. 

Personally, I also find myself looking for non-animal options more often now. So far, I've found single-pass nylon to be a favorite, as well as Artem sailcloth. Alcantara is also a synthetic material, and that might be next on my list of strap materials to try!

Wow! I was making fun but I didn’t know that! That’s pretty cool I think …

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K2bUbWs-LXc

I have ordered their straps online. Very well made.