The milled clasp brain wash
I don't mind pressed clasps. I'm not saying this just for the fun of annoying random strangers on internet forums, but because it's the truth: pressed clasps are fine.
One of my main source of information that I could access when I started to be serious about collecting watches was the internet and YouTube, there I could see for myself how a watch looked and how it was worn on a wrist, see a demonstration of all its features and everything that was missed by the brands. I didn't have to buy the watch and lament my mistakes later, and I didn't even have to exert myself and check them physically at an AD. This was great!
One of the recurring complaints heard from reviewers was about pressed clasps. They were tagged either as a cheap cost cutting measure or as a sign that the brand simply didn't care and was not attentive to its customer's wishes. Sometime they were excused under the pretext that they were fitted to a cheap watch and that a better option would also increase the price beyond what the customers would be willing to pay.
And I believed them. Why shouldn't I believe them when holding a bracelet with a milled clasp and marveling at how robust it felt, and experiencing for myself the satisfying feel of quality an engraved logo gave instead of the ahem, not so good look of a logo stamped into a sheet of thin metal?
There was just one problem and it became more apparent to me as the number of watches fitted with a milled clasp kept increasing in my collection. The majority of my milled clasps felt less comfortable than the pressed clasp on my marathon MSAR.
The marathon MSAR is not a cheap watch. When I first got it I was a bit disappointed about the bracelet with its pressed clasp and I even joked that it looked like Marathon raided a Seiko bracelet's warehouse. It took me quite a while to free myself from the YouTube brainwashing and accept it for what it was, which in the case of the MSAR is an excellent bracelet fitted with an appropriate clasp. Let me explain this if you are still interested in reading a contrarian opinion.
There is no cost cutting strategy involved in the the decision to fit a pressed clasp to the MSAR. One look at the bracelet with its rock solid (and brushed matching) end links is enough to get the idea, and if more support is needed then please feel free to look at the individual screwed links. The pressed clasp is there because this is what marathon though would be the better option and not because they wanted to save an insignificant amount of money, since many brands proved already that a milled clasp isn't really expensive and can be fitted as standard to watches costing 10% of what the MSAR does.
The MSAR pressed clasp is there because it's lighter and thinner. The oversized modern milled clasps are usually longer, wider, thicker and heavier and they don't close a bracelet any better than a good pressed clasp does.
In other words, take care of the sharp edges, tighten the tolerances a bit and a pressed clasp is fine and in the case of the MSAR it also shaves a few millimeters and grams from a watch that isn't exactly light and slim.
And turning my wrist upside down I also think that a large milled clasp would not look as good as the slimmer pressed clasp that doesn't add one single unnecessary millimeter to its width or thickness.
And so my conclusion, after deciding that it's time to descale the coffee machine, is that pressed clasps are fine as long as they are well made - which is something that can be said for about every other product that we can buy.
I'm a big fan of watches that are interesting because they are either unique, have interesting features, well designed or simply offer a great value for their price.
Well, for many of us who grew up in the 70s and 80s, pressed clasps were the only clasps we knew. I actually don’t mind pressed clasps and folded link bracelets. They work as intended and were of a certain era.
Of course if I am buying a modern $5000 (and more) watch now, I’d expect the associated contemporary quality parts to be included.
The only time I prefer a milled clasp is when it also has on the fly micro adjust.
I had a similar experience with hearing every video critique the use of a stamped clasp. It turned it into a categorically inferior component and cost cutting measure in my mind. It was one of the reasons I bought my GSAR on the rubber strap originally, although not one of the major reasons.
My first and only milled clasp is on my Khaki Auto, a notably smaller watch with thinner bracelet links, and its clasp is considerably thicker and wider than my GSAR clasp with no dive extension and three fewer micro adjust positions. The GSAR would suffer noticeably by having a thicker clasp because it's already tall and boxy for cuffs of sweatshirts and coats to slide over.
I don't mean to say stamped is better, but I also don't think milled is categorically better. My "someday" watch is a Planet Ocean, which has a massive clasp and is already very thick. I think the milled clasp looks better, and containing the on-the-fly adjustment is a valid reason for a giant clasp. However, not every design decision for every product should come down to asthetics and "premium feel."
Marathon, more than most, puts a lot of weight into task and spec oriented design, with limited compromise for asthetics or feel. Some of us find that particularly appealing, and some of us find it entirely misguided. That's all well and good, but I do believe that the content created around watches leans pretty heavily toward the audience that looks for asthetics and "premium feel." I happen to love the asthetics that arise out of not putting looks first, but I understand that a lot of people don't.
Well, for many of us who grew up in the 70s and 80s, pressed clasps were the only clasps we knew. I actually don’t mind pressed clasps and folded link bracelets. They work as intended and were of a certain era.
Of course if I am buying a modern $5000 (and more) watch now, I’d expect the associated contemporary quality parts to be included.
Classic example of the difference between something being "old, out-dated, or obsolete" and something "not working well." There are so many things these days that people seem to think won't work well just because we've come up with something that works better. A lot of these "obsolete" ideas, techniques, and tools were the best anyone had for decades, centuries, or even millenia. There's often still contexts where they remain the best.
Electric stove tops and microwaves don't make cooking over a fire any less effective than it's been for tens of thousands of years. We're actually capable now of being really quite exceptional at cooking over a fire if we decide to learn how.
As someone with zero experience with milled clasps, I've never understood why I'd want a chunkier piece of metal which offered no real benefit besides costing more.
I have an opinion, you have experience. I'm glad we agree.
@Dallen brings up an interesting point about (I'm sure there's a real term for it) modernity bias. Typically it goes the other way, where "improvements" are made for manufacturing ease and economy. Milled clasps are a bizarre counterexample where a perceived luxury causes preference for a costlier version.
Now the engine turning swirlies can be pretty, albeit on a part nobody really sees in daily wear, but I assume that this finishing could be imparted to stamped parts with modern CNC magic, so it's all moot.
You've raised some valid points, I agree though I, like most have been brainwashed into the milled clasp club, but like you say ,bigger,heavier sometimes goddamm ugly but we've a perception of value for money so for most milled is the way.
Here's an 'inferior' clasp on my 25 Yr old seiko kinetic, has it snapped no ,has it ever come undone no, has it let me down no. Light, strong, comfortable just does the job.
Yep, what you said. I think for the majority of watches I'm likely to buy a pressed clasp is fine and I've never had an issue functionally with one. I think they are a slight cost cutting exercise but that doesn't really bother me. If I was to buy an 'expensive' watch, I'd expect a milled clasp I think, but certainly for anything up to £1000 I don't think it would prevent me buying it.
Agree. The most comfortable bracelet I own has a pressed clasp and rolled links. Funny it's a Seiko 5kx bracelet, the one all the youtubers hate 😂 all my other bracelets with solid links and milled clasps don't feel as nice.
Its not the stamped/milled bit I'm fussed about, I dislike friction close & prefer twin trigger deployant for security.
Personal preference 👍🏻
As someone with zero experience with milled clasps, I've never understood why I'd want a chunkier piece of metal which offered no real benefit besides costing more.
I have an opinion, you have experience. I'm glad we agree.
@Dallen brings up an interesting point about (I'm sure there's a real term for it) modernity bias. Typically it goes the other way, where "improvements" are made for manufacturing ease and economy. Milled clasps are a bizarre counterexample where a perceived luxury causes preference for a costlier version.
Now the engine turning swirlies can be pretty, albeit on a part nobody really sees in daily wear, but I assume that this finishing could be imparted to stamped parts with modern CNC magic, so it's all moot.
One valid reason is the look. A milled clasp with its chunky shell and sturdy scissors feels like a premium product. Add a built in diver's extension or a micro adjust ratchet and everybody go "wow".
The fact that now you have a clasp the size of a lifeboat that extends beyond your wrist is something you notice only later, if ever.
Its not the stamped/milled bit I'm fussed about, I dislike friction close & prefer twin trigger deployant for security.
Personal preference 👍🏻
Personal preferences are fine.
I came out to the exact same conclusion as yours. Pressed clasps when thought about properly are lighter slimer and more confortable. For example this is the main complaint about the o&w p101 online like on the jomw review.
This is one of the most confortable bracelet I have and definitely not far of my neo vintage omega and breitling.
I have the feeling youtubers are now locked into the story that pressed clasps are sheit and they just can't go back on that statement.
Does it look wrong or not premium on wrist? Like your marathon this a non nonsense proper tool watch, stamped fits the bill.
While I like a good on the fly adjust system as found on the seamaster. I’d prefer the pressed clasp with a bunch of micro adjust holes for comfort
Sinn manage to fit in a really good divers extension into their pressed clasp that fits seamlessly within a nice compact clasp. If seiko could do the same and get rid of the horrible extension they use we would all be better off. I find the strapcode bracelets to be perfect in this respect also
This has a pressed clasp & since it's the greatest watch ever devised by God or man, it must therefore also be great. 🤓
Don't really mind either, if they are of good quality. A nice milled clasp can be more in keeping with a bracelet design sometimes? Can't say I've ever found a milled clasp uncomfortable.
All of my Orient Divers have pressed clasps as well as some of my vintage seikos. Once they are on and locked they look the same and are very comfortable.
I agree that as consumers we are brainwashed into desiring something more substantial when we don't really need it.
Great post that makes you think!
The cheapest looking bracelet that I have is fitted to my Casio AQ-230A. And it does the job just fine.
The only issue I have with Casio cheap bracelets is that they are mostly paired to watches that are just plastic and chrome coated which never match the tone of the bracelets.
Agreed.
My biggest issue is removing links.
What a PITA.
Makes me appreciate screw in links that much more.
I Mean it does depends on the watch......
A stamped clasp on a marathon tool watch Is fine
But in a dress watch?...
I Mean it does depends on the watch......
A stamped clasp on a marathon tool watch Is fine
But in a dress watch?...
Dress watches are usually on leather but let's say that you have one with a stamped clasp. So what?
It's all about comfort not strength as the universal pins are the week spots. I get rid of all the metal for comfort. It's like wearing a heavy handcuff. Half the weight is in the bracelet.
Agreed, I don't mind them. I have a stamped clasp on a doxa and the watch balances perfectly, I think a milled clasp would throw it all off.
sorry i wanna ask some question. is this considered a pressed clasp?
Like the clasp
Well taking their words as gospel means that no one, including Rolex and the other high tier manufacturers, was able to make a decent watch until 10 years ago. No milled clasps, no AR coated sapphire, no screws on the links, etcetera.
Yeah, it's pretty funny. They never seem to mention that aspect 🙄
You obviously don't own a seiko diver 😂seiko's stamped buckles are horrible, probably the reason why there is all the hate. Rattles more than a rattle snake.
You obviously don't own a seiko diver 😂seiko's stamped buckles are horrible, probably the reason why there is all the hate. Rattles more than a rattle snake.
Actually I do and it's a Seiko SP147 but it came on a terrible silicone strap, which just reinforce what I wrote. Everything can be terrible or good, depending on how its made.
I had a pressed clasp on my 1988-era Submariner... and it was the only thing about the watch that I felt was disappointing. I use my watches hard. And I was constantly having to bend and adjust it. Gimme a milled clasp any day of he week!
Actually I do and it's a Seiko SP147 but it came on a terrible silicone strap, which just reinforce what I wrote. Everything can be terrible or good, depending on how its made.
Yeah I meant a base Seiko on a bracelet
Potato peelers haven’t really improved from a good small sharp blade “ In the right hands” . But TV sells us everywhere the new potato peeler . Claude good article.
Potato peelers haven’t really improved from a good small sharp blade “ In the right hands” . But TV sells us everywhere the new potato peeler . Claude good article.
They did improve, sort of. Some smart guys realized years ago that the potato peeling problem could be solved quite elegantly by adopting a trick from the Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy, selling pre-peeled potatos and making it "someone else problem".
Now, this is what I call a real progress!
Infinite probability drive problem 😂