Things I Don't Like about Vintage
Do I still need a disclaimer that I'm not actually hating on vintage watches? I hope not. You only need to look at my gallery to see I love vintage. But just because you love something doesn't mean you can't acknowledge the negative things about it.
I'm just having a bit of fun here. Nothing should be sacrosanct, especially not watches. So, here we go:
1) Let's start with the big one. No one cares -- yeah yeah, no one cares about your watches except you and all that. But, surely, people have to care about actual historical pieces, right? You can show me an vintage rotary telephone and I can appreciate the intricacies and history of said object. Not so with watches. The world outside the watch community is just as apathetic about vintage watches as they are about modern watches. The universe is cold and uncaring and there is no justice.
2) Redials and period-incorrect replaced parts everywhere. For the rest of the world, if something needs fixing you fix. That chair your grandfather sat on for 40 years had been worn-out and now reeks of your grandpapi's swamp ass, you reupholster. So why don't we have the same regard for watches? Cars get repainted all the time. You slap on a new paint on a 1960s Corvette and not only will the new buyer thank you for it, they might even cry tears of happiness. But no, you do anything beyond lightly brush a dial and you've committed an atrocious crime that deserves deathrow. The universe is cold and uncaring and there is no justice.
3) Prices are based on what exactly? Some watches are more expensive than others. But how are prices determined? How is a 1937 Hamilton Lester more expensive than a 1937 Hamilton Endicott? It's the same brand, same period, same aesthetics, same indices, same dial color, same movement inside. Oh, the Lester is rectangular and therefore more expensive? Is it rarity? Yeah, okay. Speaking of which...
4) Rarity shouldn't be a basis for extra cost. They're all rare by virtue of the fact that they existed longer than some of us are alive. Prove to me that there are fewer Lesters out there than Endicotts. Where is the data? What report from what government agency are you basing this all from? Why am I paying rarity tax for some watches and not for others?
5) Small size. Now, before I get flogged by our more ascerbic vintage brothers and sisters, I don't mean wear. I love the wear of small watches. I prefer the wear of small sizes, even in modern watches. It's the other, uhm, complications (hah!) that come with small sizes that I'm ranting about. Some of them are so small it's difficult to use the crown. Just because I already used it as an example, I rarely wear my Hamilton Lester these days because that crown is impossible. I can barely pull it out without fear of breaking it. When I push it back in, good luck winding the damn thing, my chubby sausage fingers almost always slip off. And then there's the legibility issue. Some watches are so small, coupled with how patinaed the dials are, that sometimes I can only see the hands at certain light and angles. I don't exactly have the best eyes for small watches, old age and all. I know I know--the universe is cold and uncaring and there is no justice.
6) Speaking of patina--yes yes. Love evenly distributed patina. It's when it's uneven that grinds my gears. Uneven patina just looks, well, grimy. They don't complement the aesthetics of the watch, they just ruin it. At least for me. Now I could have it redialed, sure, but see number 2.
There are other reasons to not like vintage--water resistance is non-existent, acrylic crystal, etc--but these to me are irrelevant. So I won't elaborate on those here. I've never not bought a vintage watch because it has zero water resistance or that it didn't come with sapphire.
Again, I do love vintage watches and I plan to keep buying them. Well, upgrading the ones I already have anyway. I do also want to pare down my collection, but that's a tangent. If it's a choice between something modern and vintage, I usually default to wearing the vintage unless there's a specific reason to wear modern. There are more pros than there are cons. So if you've never tried vintage and want to take the plunge, add me to the voices of encouragement. It's less risky than you think. The rewards are a-plenty. Just be mindful of what you're buying and have a different set of standards than you do with modern watches. You want something to go spelunking with, don't get vintage.
*photos are by me but the watches are owned by @collectiblewatchesmanila.
I've got a god-shaped hole in my life that I'm trying to fill in futility with watches.
I LOVE vintage watches, but agree with a lot of your points too. 😊
Man are you spot on, on every aspect of vintage collecting. I love vintage watches too. It's a fun roller coaster to ride collecting them. I buy mine usually at auction. It's hard to determine what is worth what? I bid to how I feel about it. Like you said, there is no database to let us know values.
I'm diving deep into vintage watches for several reasons, including some of your reasons. Mainly because I love the look and size of vintage watches. But I also really don't like the look and size of new watches.
I could go on but I'll just say that I'm with you on vintage watches 🤩
I could really turn this into a post of its own, but I think that you missed the biggest negative to vintage: your watch has already, through nothing but luck, exceeded its useful life. It is going to malfunction, fail, stop working like a watch should and you may never be able to set it right again. You or your watchmaker will search for a part that hasn't been made in 70 years. The first time you get a watch serviced it may take a few weeks. By the third time it seems more like the cycle of Halley's Comet. I took my old Roamer in because it was just a little slower than my broad tolerances allow. My watchmaker tells me that it is slow because it is missing a jewel. It is missing a jewel because he lost it in disassembly. He asks if I want him to keep looking for it. "However long it takes," I say. Don't expect that one in WRUW anytime soon.
And that story illustrates the former strength of the old Swiss system. Had it been an ETA, AS, or Felsa, parts would have been readily available, even now. Using off the shelf movements kept watches running. Roamer was "in-house" for its day, running an old MST 372. That movement is not exactly rare, but it is not as common as an AS 1287.
If you have five well made modern watches you may not need another for a decade or more. If you own vintage watches you know that you need many times that number. Every vintage watch has only so many days left in it. May as well spread them over a longer time with a deep rotation. Vintage collectors always have one or more "in the shop." I have three, which is about average. I have had as many as seven being repaired.
You skipped past water resistance, but if you see me wearing a modern diver or field watch in the WRUW you can bet that there is a very good chance of heavy rain in my area. I have had too many vintage watches fog up after running from the car to the front door in rain.
Agreed on all points. I've actually been thinking of point #2 quite a lot recently because I've been considering adding vintage piece to my collection & was also comparing them to older cars in the exact same way. It can be silly at times to not replace or repair a busted set of hands/ dial/ crystal for the sake of originality.
I'll tell you something I DO like about vintage - all of the problems you listed (and more) make me appreciate how nice watches are now!
I could really turn this into a post of its own, but I think that you missed the biggest negative to vintage: your watch has already, through nothing but luck, exceeded its useful life. It is going to malfunction, fail, stop working like a watch should and you may never be able to set it right again. You or your watchmaker will search for a part that hasn't been made in 70 years. The first time you get a watch serviced it may take a few weeks. By the third time it seems more like the cycle of Halley's Comet. I took my old Roamer in because it was just a little slower than my broad tolerances allow. My watchmaker tells me that it is slow because it is missing a jewel. It is missing a jewel because he lost it in disassembly. He asks if I want him to keep looking for it. "However long it takes," I say. Don't expect that one in WRUW anytime soon.
And that story illustrates the former strength of the old Swiss system. Had it been an ETA, AS, or Felsa, parts would have been readily available, even now. Using off the shelf movements kept watches running. Roamer was "in-house" for its day, running an old MST 372. That movement is not exactly rare, but it is not as common as an AS 1287.
If you have five well made modern watches you may not need another for a decade or more. If you own vintage watches you know that you need many times that number. Every vintage watch has only so many days left in it. May as well spread them over a longer time with a deep rotation. Vintage collectors always have one or more "in the shop." I have three, which is about average. I have had as many as seven being repaired.
You skipped past water resistance, but if you see me wearing a modern diver or field watch in the WRUW you can bet that there is a very good chance of heavy rain in my area. I have had too many vintage watches fog up after running from the car to the front door in rain.
Not that it's a competition but I got you beat in number of watches "in the shop". Currently have 4 with another one waiting to be sent out.
As for your more important point: you're absolutely right. I never even thought of it that way: for an 80 year old watch, every day it ticks is a gift. Though, sometimes, the gift is a pair of socks.
I LOVE vintage watches, but agree with a lot of your points too. 😊
Thanks!
Man are you spot on, on every aspect of vintage collecting. I love vintage watches too. It's a fun roller coaster to ride collecting them. I buy mine usually at auction. It's hard to determine what is worth what? I bid to how I feel about it. Like you said, there is no database to let us know values.
It's a rollercoaster ride that does not stop, even when you've had enough.
Agreed on all points. I've actually been thinking of point #2 quite a lot recently because I've been considering adding vintage piece to my collection & was also comparing them to older cars in the exact same way. It can be silly at times to not replace or repair a busted set of hands/ dial/ crystal for the sake of originality.
I have several watches with replaced crystals. Replaced crystals never bothered me. I have one that no longer has its original hands--that bothers me just a little bit. It's a buzzing fly in my personal space. I don't see why it should bother me but it still does.
I'm diving deep into vintage watches for several reasons, including some of your reasons. Mainly because I love the look and size of vintage watches. But I also really don't like the look and size of new watches.
I could go on but I'll just say that I'm with you on vintage watches 🤩
Thanks for reading. Keep collecting vintage!
I'll tell you something I DO like about vintage - all of the problems you listed (and more) make me appreciate how nice watches are now!
Problems with vintage shouldn't dissuade anyone from buying them. Way I see it, high-maintenance shouldn't mean unworthy, you know? The harder you need to take care of something, the more intimate you feel about that something.
I have several watches with replaced crystals. Replaced crystals never bothered me. I have one that no longer has its original hands--that bothers me just a little bit. It's a buzzing fly in my personal space. I don't see why it should bother me but it still does.
Understandable. Does it bother you that they are newer hands or is it a matter of the hands not matching the model/ style of the rest of the watch?
Problems with vintage shouldn't dissuade anyone from buying them. Way I see it, high-maintenance shouldn't mean unworthy, you know? The harder you need to take care of something, the more intimate you feel about that something.
As you said, I'm not knocking vintage either! I have owned many - but truly and without sarcasm, the challenges older pieces face really do make me say, "Wow, this watch from 2023 that I paid $200 for has twice the water resistance / power reserve / shock protection / better bracelet" etc etc etc. We live in the past's future, it's nice!
I could really turn this into a post of its own, but I think that you missed the biggest negative to vintage: your watch has already, through nothing but luck, exceeded its useful life. It is going to malfunction, fail, stop working like a watch should and you may never be able to set it right again. You or your watchmaker will search for a part that hasn't been made in 70 years. The first time you get a watch serviced it may take a few weeks. By the third time it seems more like the cycle of Halley's Comet. I took my old Roamer in because it was just a little slower than my broad tolerances allow. My watchmaker tells me that it is slow because it is missing a jewel. It is missing a jewel because he lost it in disassembly. He asks if I want him to keep looking for it. "However long it takes," I say. Don't expect that one in WRUW anytime soon.
And that story illustrates the former strength of the old Swiss system. Had it been an ETA, AS, or Felsa, parts would have been readily available, even now. Using off the shelf movements kept watches running. Roamer was "in-house" for its day, running an old MST 372. That movement is not exactly rare, but it is not as common as an AS 1287.
If you have five well made modern watches you may not need another for a decade or more. If you own vintage watches you know that you need many times that number. Every vintage watch has only so many days left in it. May as well spread them over a longer time with a deep rotation. Vintage collectors always have one or more "in the shop." I have three, which is about average. I have had as many as seven being repaired.
You skipped past water resistance, but if you see me wearing a modern diver or field watch in the WRUW you can bet that there is a very good chance of heavy rain in my area. I have had too many vintage watches fog up after running from the car to the front door in rain.
I forgot to mention that I relate to the whole water resistance issue you pointed out. I always bring an extra modern watch whenever I'm wearing a vintage out on the town. While at a restaurant, I had been mocked by non-watch friends who would call me out for changing my watch mid-conversation. They don't need to check their phones to see if it's raining outside. They just need to check what I have on my wrist.
Great summary Sherwin!
But you left the most annoying one off the list...
So I will add it...
7) You can't find a decent watchmaker to service vintage watches...they just aren't worth the time of a quality watchmaker...let alone trying to find parts. And if it is a vintage chronograph with issues...you may as well just toss into the watchbox and forget about it. And don't even get me started on vintage Hamilton Electrics...there is like one guy in the whole USA who will work on them and you need expertise even to change the battery. When you do get them serviced...the cost of servicing is 1/3 the price of the watch.
Despite all of the issues...I love vintage watches. My wife...not so much (she doesn't love vintage watches) 😉...her typical response, "You bought another one of those? They all look the same...why do you keep buying the same watches that all have problems and are too small."
No. 6: Patina, one persons charasmatic patina is anothers old worn out watch.
I don't see acyrlic as being a negative, I like it as a feature. The therapeutic delight in polishing out a glaring scratch, hang on! Is that scratch patina, er, hmm.
Great summary Sherwin!
But you left the most annoying one off the list...
So I will add it...
7) You can't find a decent watchmaker to service vintage watches...they just aren't worth the time of a quality watchmaker...let alone trying to find parts. And if it is a vintage chronograph with issues...you may as well just toss into the watchbox and forget about it. And don't even get me started on vintage Hamilton Electrics...there is like one guy in the whole USA who will work on them and you need expertise even to change the battery. When you do get them serviced...the cost of servicing is 1/3 the price of the watch.
Despite all of the issues...I love vintage watches. My wife...not so much (she doesn't love vintage watches) 😉...her typical response, "You bought another one of those? They all look the same...why do you keep buying the same watches that all have problems and are too small."
I read that last paragraph different: I love vintage watches, my wife not so much.... made me laugh so hard.
My man, you are spot on!
No. 6: Patina, one persons charasmatic patina is anothers old worn out watch.
I don't see acyrlic as being a negative, I like it as a feature. The therapeutic delight in polishing out a glaring scratch, hang on! Is that scratch patina, er, hmm.
PREACH BROTHA! I don't care about sapphire in the slightest.
I’m not sure what to say here…
I’m not sure what to say here…
You can be as ascerbic as you like, I don't bleed so easily, not that you need anyone's permission. It's all in good fun.
Yeah me too. I don't care how aesthetically pleasing it may be, at the end of the day I just want a product that works and works well.
Great summary Sherwin!
But you left the most annoying one off the list...
So I will add it...
7) You can't find a decent watchmaker to service vintage watches...they just aren't worth the time of a quality watchmaker...let alone trying to find parts. And if it is a vintage chronograph with issues...you may as well just toss into the watchbox and forget about it. And don't even get me started on vintage Hamilton Electrics...there is like one guy in the whole USA who will work on them and you need expertise even to change the battery. When you do get them serviced...the cost of servicing is 1/3 the price of the watch.
Despite all of the issues...I love vintage watches. My wife...not so much (she doesn't love vintage watches) 😉...her typical response, "You bought another one of those? They all look the same...why do you keep buying the same watches that all have problems and are too small."
"You bought another one of those? They all look the same...why do you keep buying the same watches that all have problems and are too small."
Have you been spying on my vintage seamaster collection again?
I’m left with a “The universe is cold and uncaring and there is no justice” feeling in my brain.
Bruno, you make really good points here… the small crown size is something that always makes it difficult for me to wind my one and only vintage watch. And just like you, other than that, I love the fitting of a 34-35mm watch.
There’s also some stress that comes with a vintage purchase of it not being redialed and all that. Of course, there’s the “buy the seller, not the watch” thing, but hey… It’s a thing, and one that deter people from going vintage.
This is been a very entertaining post to read. Thanks!
I love the look of vintage watches, but I don't have time to get a PHID in vintage. lol. You really have to know so many things about the watch you want to buy. I do have quite a few vintage watches, but I hardly ever wear them, I have them proudly displayed in my collection and just admire them for the look and imagine the life they lived before me. Also, finding a watchmaker that works on them is not as easy as it looks. I tried, and many of the guys didn't do that kind of work, or it was just too expensive. In other words, most of them tried to talk me out of it saying it wasn't worth it.
It's funny but all the things you listed I actually like about vintage watches. I own a few and have always been drawn to the smaller sizes and patina.
Thanks for the great points I have just one vintage digital as a starter. But for sure I would like to get at least one good vintage watch something like my birth year having a hard time deciding what you think a 1969 Bulova Accutron? or 1969 Timex of any model? It’s on my bucket list. don’t care if the bracelet is bad I just want the watch working.
Thanks for the great points I have just one vintage digital as a starter. But for sure I would like to get at least one good vintage watch something like my birth year having a hard time deciding what you think a 1969 Bulova Accutron? or 1969 Timex of any model? It’s on my bucket list. don’t care if the bracelet is bad I just want the watch working.
I'm probably not the right person to ask about watch choices. I'm not a details guy and, between two choices, I tend to go for what looks better, features be damned. Specs are lost on me.
That said, you can't go wrong with a vintage Timex Marlin. Alternatively, seeing as you were born in the same year Seiko blew up the entire watch industry with the first ever quartz watch -- well, Seiko Quartz Astron?
I'm probably not the right person to ask about watch choices. I'm not a details guy and, between two choices, I tend to go for what looks better, features be damned. Specs are lost on me.
That said, you can't go wrong with a vintage Timex Marlin. Alternatively, seeing as you were born in the same year Seiko blew up the entire watch industry with the first ever quartz watch -- well, Seiko Quartz Astron?
Looks very interesting 🧐 gonna look deep into those Seikos. All I need is just one good vintage.