Do you have problem with "homage"?

Happy weekend watchfam, i hope you're doing well. allow me to share some of my experience with steinhart watch. last night one of my friend lent me one of his watch for me, it is a 39mm steinhart ocean one vintage military. yes it is a straight up homage of vintage submariner (with a few different element), and apparently he's stop wearing it and buy an omega seamaster instead few years later.

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as im not familiar with this brand im do a little digging on the website. quick info steinhart is a german brand which produced many homage rolex with different combination, you want a batman gmt, modern or vintage submariner? they got it, and the site doesnt seem to sugarcoat this. but lately they try to produced  other models with more less homage approach like their flieger or chronograph variant. most of the steinhart watch have a good specs for the price. swiss movement (sellita or eta), saphire crystal, enough water resistant, and solid bracelet. talking about know what customer want. from pricepoint, this specific model is the same as seiko sumo at my country

despite all of the negative connotation about a homage, lets take look at the watch shall we?

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dial:

pretty much like vintage sub with no date with watch type and steinhart logo on it, diver indices applied with superluminova, indices colour also give a vintage feel. the hands is also different than rolex consist of pencil, diamond, and arrow hand.

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crystal:

domed saphire with antirelective coated on the interior

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case:

39mm stainless steel with brushed and polish finished, feels pretty good. solid backcase with some specs description

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bezel and bezel insert:

its a unidirectional click with inlay gloss black aluminium on the insert. not really sure what inlay black aluminium means, but from the looks of it im pretty sure its a ceramic. and oh man the bezel click feels soo good and solid, it is far from my own orient bezel

crown:

screw down crown with some detail on it. screw down crown feels solid and have different mechanism than my other japanese dive watch

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movement:

eta 2824-2 with 28800 bph and 38 hours reserved. no day date complication

bracelet and buckle:

and this is my favourite part of the watch. im not a fan of entry level japanese watch bracelet (so far im experiencing seiko and orient). brushed finishing always feel too rough for my taste and rattle too much, also buckle always feel cheap. one day i upgraded my orient bracelet with a miltat/strapcode, its a little upgrade (solid endlink, and screw pin) but its not up to my expectation for 100$ bracelet. but steinhart bracelet is different, yeah its same 316 stainless with brushed finishing but when you hold it trust me you know the quality different. brushed finishing feels soft, it didnt rattle too much, and the buckle feels solid

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conclusion:

for me personally im more proud purchasing a watch with "more original design element" just like the owner of this watch but holding this steinhart may change some of my thought especially for this brand (cannot say its same with other homage brand). yes its straight up homage from vintage submariner, but they put the budget somewhere else which is the specs and built quality. and if i may choose this ocean one or seiko sumo, i may purchase this steinhart instead. so what do you guys think? have you ever experience homage brand watch? is it bad or good? thx for reading. cheers🍺

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Again your photography is amazing my friend!! The low light sexy business thing going on is spot on 😉…

 I‘m ambivalent about homages part of me says it’s a copycat might as well save for the real one and then there’s part of me says hey save your money and get a homage one…I guess depends on the watch for me, if I see a watch that I really like sometimes it doesn’t matter who made it...

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I got a YachtMaster homage without knowing what either an homage or a YM were to begin with. Didn’t think of that when getting it, just really liked what I saw and what was spec’d.

Now that I know, I’d buy an homage again. If a company has the courage to put their logo and brand on an inspired by/or tribute/or homage/or copy/what-have-you, and acknowledge that the design isn’t entirely their own, then I’m fine with it.

fakes on the other hand can go fake themself in the worst ways imaginable.

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I definitely appreciate Steinhart’s quality and value. I’m fine with homages to watches that are unavailable from the manufacturer. A vintage Rolex, or discontinued model, etc. I have more of a problem, personally, with copies of currently available models, like all the Pagani clones of current Omegas, etc., and outright fakes are bad.

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I owned a Steinhart ocean 39 and really liked it. I flipped it for something else but I‘d buy another for sure. Theres a big difference between and homage and a fake, and sometimes it seems people who dislike homages consider them one and the same. They aren’t. Legit brands like Steinhart, Squale, Davosa and others offer excellent homages to classic designs while also being their own thing at a fraction of the cost. Also, and this is just my opinion, it often feels like people who hate on homages are privileged enough to actually own the original. So good for you (truly) if you have a real GMT master 2, but because I can’t cough up the $15k for one I just can’t experience that classic design on my wrist some other way? Feels kinda elitist to me frankly. I say to each their own. It’s your money. Wear what you want! 

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I have no problem with homages or people that wear and enjoy them. However, they aren’t for me.

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Bought this a few weeks back and posted on how surprised I was at how good it is...

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Ichibunz

Again your photography is amazing my friend!! The low light sexy business thing going on is spot on 😉…

 I‘m ambivalent about homages part of me says it’s a copycat might as well save for the real one and then there’s part of me says hey save your money and get a homage one…I guess depends on the watch for me, if I see a watch that I really like sometimes it doesn’t matter who made it...

thx, really appreciate it. im not really into straight copy. but with a qulity like this who can resist? 😂😂

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Off top, this is a great watch and value. Homage watches are a great way to enjoy models that either no longer exist or are out of a collector's price range. The Submariner design has been closely "re-imagined" by so many brands. It's cool to see a brand offer a quality homage piece.  Good to know the bracelet is solid. Great photography for this submission!

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Give me an homage that adopts enough differences to achieve some originality. I would never buy an android clone of my wife as a second partner 😛. BTW, I love your English construction and conjugation style. It's like reading a script for a steampunk movie! 

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GasWorks

Bought this a few weeks back and posted on how surprised I was at how good it is...

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I've seriously considered Pagani Design -- I believe you have convinced me kind sir.

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DariusII

I've seriously considered Pagani Design -- I believe you have convinced me kind sir.

Not sure how good all Pagani watches are but for circa £80 this one is pretty good. Have a look at Jody's review here...

https://youtu.be/z8wOsQZy99o

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TheSharperTheBetter
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I got a YachtMaster homage without knowing what either an homage or a YM were to begin with. Didn’t think of that when getting it, just really liked what I saw and what was spec’d.

Now that I know, I’d buy an homage again. If a company has the courage to put their logo and brand on an inspired by/or tribute/or homage/or copy/what-have-you, and acknowledge that the design isn’t entirely their own, then I’m fine with it.

fakes on the other hand can go fake themself in the worst ways imaginable.

well said my friend, im watching marc btw lol

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agree with you, its a good alternative with affordable price 🍺

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GasWorks

Bought this a few weeks back and posted on how surprised I was at how good it is...

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nice, i never experience pagani, is the bracelet feels nice?

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Great photography. I just sat down this morning to research the possibility of purchasing from one of these "homage" brands and this post was at the top of my WC feed. I hope you keep us all posted about how you like the Steinhart if you decide to buy.

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I own a few watches that are homages or heavily inspired by other watches. My Helson Sharkmaster 300 is damn near an exact representation of the 1965 Omega 165.024. The dimensions , the design, the typography.. everything. They adapted the name and everything to their own branding of-course. Objectively I felt it was actually a better value than sourcing an Original Omega.. I felt it was improved actually.. Modern(ish) Swiss automatic movement thats well known and any watchmaker can service, that runs +/- 1 Sec/day. Has 300m of water resistance (that I would trust... vintage watches typically are not recommended for use in that manner) The lugs are drilled, the original was not, the bezel insert and crystal are modern materials; sapphire not acrylic/hesilite - I know I know purists will be like HOLD ON - but in this case I prefer the durability. The Bezels knurling or grip is improved with "taller" texture compared to the original... At the end of the day I buy and wear watches that make me smile.. 

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Billy.wears.watches

I own a few watches that are homages or heavily inspired by other watches. My Helson Sharkmaster 300 is damn near an exact representation of the 1965 Omega 165.024. The dimensions , the design, the typography.. everything. They adapted the name and everything to their own branding of-course. Objectively I felt it was actually a better value than sourcing an Original Omega.. I felt it was improved actually.. Modern(ish) Swiss automatic movement thats well known and any watchmaker can service, that runs +/- 1 Sec/day. Has 300m of water resistance (that I would trust... vintage watches typically are not recommended for use in that manner) The lugs are drilled, the original was not, the bezel insert and crystal are modern materials; sapphire not acrylic/hesilite - I know I know purists will be like HOLD ON - but in this case I prefer the durability. The Bezels knurling or grip is improved with "taller" texture compared to the original... At the end of the day I buy and wear watches that make me smile.. 

talking about practicality and affordability. thats great 👍

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I just bought my first homage two weeks ago and it arrives today. For me, I could not justify the original watch cost. I will see if I wasted money in few weeks of wear. If you’re happy with it, then that is what matters. 

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Chfoo78

I have no problem with homage as long as they use their own brand name😬

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Rocking with my sharkmaster 300

I have the same model... although not the Big triangle version.. Its an absolute awesome homage!

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This has been hashed to death all over the internet but here is how I look at it.  I think the term 'homage' is over used in the watch space.  The watch in the OP is a replica.  Not a fake but a replica of the original.  A homage should take inspiration from other designs but not try to be a replica.  For example the CW Dartmouth is a good example of an homage.  It has elements of both the MOD Seamasters and MOD MilSubs while taking it in CWs own direction.

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I don't have any issue with replicas or homages.  Both are fine.  We can all agree that there is no room for fakes.  

My own personal line for homages/replicas is whether or not I could reasonably afford the actual watch in question.  The chance to own a MilSub (of which the Vintage Military in the OP is a replica of) has passed me by about 20 years.  I have had the Vintage Military in my cart more times than I care to count. Love the look of the watch.  

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rkovars

This has been hashed to death all over the internet but here is how I look at it.  I think the term 'homage' is over used in the watch space.  The watch in the OP is a replica.  Not a fake but a replica of the original.  A homage should take inspiration from other designs but not try to be a replica.  For example the CW Dartmouth is a good example of an homage.  It has elements of both the MOD Seamasters and MOD MilSubs while taking it in CWs own direction.

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I don't have any issue with replicas or homages.  Both are fine.  We can all agree that there is no room for fakes.  

My own personal line for homages/replicas is whether or not I could reasonably afford the actual watch in question.  The chance to own a MilSub (of which the Vintage Military in the OP is a replica of) has passed me by about 20 years.  I have had the Vintage Military in my cart more times than I care to count. Love the look of the watch.  

i think so too as im not familiar with vintage sub. but then @AFChris give me some info about this model is a vintage milsub with steinhart logo. other than that its pretty much the same style so i dont know what to called it, probably a replica. lol

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Just saw this chat.  Very good points made by all.  My $.02, I just bought a Steinhart Ocean One Vintage GMT with patina dial.  It is a very close copy of the Rolex 1655 which hasn't been on sale for 40 years.  It seems like great value for money for me and I love the look of it.  I don't feel bad buying a homage of a watch whose only availability is for crazy money on the used market.  For me, I need a persuasive use case to justify an additional purchase.  I actually bought this rather inexpensive watch as a travel watch for when I go to dodgy places around the world and don't want to risk my Tudor Black Bay Pro, which looks very, very similar to it.  This Steinhart is of such good quality, it compares favorably with my BBP, imho.  I think homages make great choices for many and offer a terrific alternative.  I can remember when Tudor was considered a poor man's Rolex and that did turn me off the brand a bit.  But that was long, long ago and I think I've grown and matured in the hobby.  All the best.  

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Malikknows

Just saw this chat.  Very good points made by all.  My $.02, I just bought a Steinhart Ocean One Vintage GMT with patina dial.  It is a very close copy of the Rolex 1655 which hasn't been on sale for 40 years.  It seems like great value for money for me and I love the look of it.  I don't feel bad buying a homage of a watch whose only availability is for crazy money on the used market.  For me, I need a persuasive use case to justify an additional purchase.  I actually bought this rather inexpensive watch as a travel watch for when I go to dodgy places around the world and don't want to risk my Tudor Black Bay Pro, which looks very, very similar to it.  This Steinhart is of such good quality, it compares favorably with my BBP, imho.  I think homages make great choices for many and offer a terrific alternative.  I can remember when Tudor was considered a poor man's Rolex and that did turn me off the brand a bit.  But that was long, long ago and I think I've grown and matured in the hobby.  All the best.  

absolutely sir, i guess there is something for everyone in this collecting hobby. and quality is good too, i like the steinhart bracelet more than the seiko bracelet at the nearly same price

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Personally, I have no problems with homages. I ordered a Loreo Sub homage and waiting for it to be delivered as we speak. Depending on how that goes, if I end up liking it, etc, I may or may not get another one.

Why did I get the Loreo? Well, because I wanted a 200m beater that I can rough up. For around 60USD, I'm getting that and a genuine sapphire crystal to boot!

I don't have 15k USD to throw away on a Rolex, even if I wanted to (which I don't--I don't like Rolex as a brand). And even if I did like Rolex and even if I have 15k extra in my bank account, I don't think I could justify the cost -- kid's tuition to pay, car payments to think of, maybe I want to travel outside of the country this summer -- so many reasons not to burn thousands of dollars on a thing that you wear on your wrist to tell time. I've said that in many comments I have made here because it's a good reminder (for myself) not to take watch collecting seriously. What am I really gathering? Small scraps of steel, glass, plastic put together to fulfill a function that my phone already does (and does it so much better and more accurately, not just in my timezone but in ALL the timezones). Put that way, spending less than 100 USD already feels like throwing away good money after bad.

Why not get something original at that price point instead of a copy of something luxurious that I couldn't afford in the first place? That seems to be the thing that drives the anti-homage crowd crazy. The flippant answer to that is, because I don't want to. It's a shallow answer but not an invalid one. The less flippant answer is, because I don't owe these big watch brand companies anything. It's not like buying a homage is akin to stabbing a friend in the back. I'm not taking money from those who worked on the Submariner or will work on future iterations of the Submariner. They will still get paid (I think). In other words, my actions have no direct consequences to anyone other than myself (if the Loreo is a dud I'm out 60 USD).

What about the other watches at the same price range? If I buy the Loreo, surely that must mean I'm taking away a potential sale from Casio? I could've gotten a GShock for the same amount of money, except again, the flippant retort: I don't want a GShock. It's not like I'm spending my GShock cash on a Loreo. I don't have money earmarked for GShock. So Casio wasn't going to get my business anyway.

My two cents.

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brunofrankelli

Personally, I have no problems with homages. I ordered a Loreo Sub homage and waiting for it to be delivered as we speak. Depending on how that goes, if I end up liking it, etc, I may or may not get another one.

Why did I get the Loreo? Well, because I wanted a 200m beater that I can rough up. For around 60USD, I'm getting that and a genuine sapphire crystal to boot!

I don't have 15k USD to throw away on a Rolex, even if I wanted to (which I don't--I don't like Rolex as a brand). And even if I did like Rolex and even if I have 15k extra in my bank account, I don't think I could justify the cost -- kid's tuition to pay, car payments to think of, maybe I want to travel outside of the country this summer -- so many reasons not to burn thousands of dollars on a thing that you wear on your wrist to tell time. I've said that in many comments I have made here because it's a good reminder (for myself) not to take watch collecting seriously. What am I really gathering? Small scraps of steel, glass, plastic put together to fulfill a function that my phone already does (and does it so much better and more accurately, not just in my timezone but in ALL the timezones). Put that way, spending less than 100 USD already feels like throwing away good money after bad.

Why not get something original at that price point instead of a copy of something luxurious that I couldn't afford in the first place? That seems to be the thing that drives the anti-homage crowd crazy. The flippant answer to that is, because I don't want to. It's a shallow answer but not an invalid one. The less flippant answer is, because I don't owe these big watch brand companies anything. It's not like buying a homage is akin to stabbing a friend in the back. I'm not taking money from those who worked on the Submariner or will work on future iterations of the Submariner. They will still get paid (I think). In other words, my actions have no direct consequences to anyone other than myself (if the Loreo is a dud I'm out 60 USD).

What about the other watches at the same price range? If I buy the Loreo, surely that must mean I'm taking away a potential sale from Casio? I could've gotten a GShock for the same amount of money, except again, the flippant retort: I don't want a GShock. It's not like I'm spending my GShock cash on a Loreo. I don't have money earmarked for GShock. So Casio wasn't going to get my business anyway.

My two cents.

i totally agree with you, it depends on everybody's choice and taste. as long as it is not fake and have a good quality. until now my collection isnt much and expensive, there are far more priority than bought an expensive piece. of course i want it someday but not now. 🍻

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Unholy

i totally agree with you, it depends on everybody's choice and taste. as long as it is not fake and have a good quality. until now my collection isnt much and expensive, there are far more priority than bought an expensive piece. of course i want it someday but not now. 🍻

Exactly. I too want to get expensive pieces. My goal is 1 high-end piece per year. By expensive I mean above 1,000 USD. But that's 1 watch purchase in a year. What do I do with the rest of the year? Not be into watches?

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i know right, what im supposed to post or made a content if i just buy one watch per year lol

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I own this beauty and I am really satisfied! Amazing specs 👌

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watchguard77

I own this beauty and I am really satisfied! Amazing specs 👌

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awesome piece sir 🙏🏻🙏🏻

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Unholy

awesome piece sir 🙏🏻🙏🏻

Thank you 🙏