New Seiko Divers

Gotta feeling these are gonna be very popular. 😆

I like ‘em!

No kidding. I know some people don’t like the date position or the extra lines of writing, but that definitely won’t stop these from flying off the shelf.

This is a great lineup. I also believe the Citizen is a better watch. Seiko just has the cachet in this department

Really? In what way does Seiko have more "cachet" outside of the Watch Enthusiast echo chamber?

To my knowledge Citizen has been more associated with diving than Seiko, among actual divers.

Seiko has been making watches for 30 plus years longer than Citizen. Citizen has no history of making and/or competing in any Neuchâtel Observatory contests where Seiko excelled at in the late 1960's . The late 1960's was the rise of Seiko dive watches that found their way onto the wrists of commercial, civilian and military divers in an erra when dive watches were actual dive equipment. The Willard may be named after a fictional character but the watch is period correct. The Rolex/Tudor DOD contract did not extend to all branches of US forces. Seiko divers made a name for themselves as true tools. Today a dive watch is at best a redundant back up that shouldn't be relied on in any dive situation: recreational, commercial or military. Computers are the real dive tool. Citizen is a great dive watch. Many divers wear Citizen for good reason. Keeping accurate time as a dive tool isn't one of them. When I started diving we used plastic dive tables and a watch. In the end I wore a watch out of nostalgia. I'm actually a water resistance proponent (different conversation) I love a great diver. Seiko has a ton of history and product line. Seiko, Seiko Prospex, Prospex LX and Grand Seiko. Look at that long catalog under all product lines. Citizen isn't even close. IMO the Citizen in your comparison has a better movement and case. Seiko Shogun Prospex SPB189J1 SPB189J1 SPB189J Titanium Diving Watch doesn't come close to the Citizen Promaster Titanium Diver. The Shogun movement is not comparable. The Shogun build is nice but it worth the extra $/ price difference versus the Citizen. Your own comparison is against Seiko 62MAS models. What was the Citizen dive watch that competed with the original 62MAS watches? The Citizen is the true dive tool in the comparison. Seiko is the dive watch with the history. This is no different from the Swiss brands with long histories. Certina makes a great Titanium dive watch. Certina has some history with their dive products. I would not put that up against the Submariner, 50 Fathoms or Seamaster. The 62MAS will sell like crazy because it's a beautiful, well-built diver from Seiko. Seiko will also sell far more dive watches from all of their product lines. I'll bet non watch nerds would name Seiko long before Citizen when asked about dive watches.

Seiko has been making watches for 30 plus years longer than Citizen. Citizen has no history of making and/or competing in any Neuchâtel Observatory contests where Seiko excelled at in the late 1960's . The late 1960's was the rise of Seiko dive watches that found their way onto the wrists of commercial, civilian and military divers in an erra when dive watches were actual dive equipment. The Willard may be named after a fictional character but the watch is period correct. The Rolex/Tudor DOD contract did not extend to all branches of US forces. Seiko divers made a name for themselves as true tools. Today a dive watch is at best a redundant back up that shouldn't be relied on in any dive situation: recreational, commercial or military. Computers are the real dive tool. Citizen is a great dive watch. Many divers wear Citizen for good reason. Keeping accurate time as a dive tool isn't one of them. When I started diving we used plastic dive tables and a watch. In the end I wore a watch out of nostalgia. I'm actually a water resistance proponent (different conversation) I love a great diver. Seiko has a ton of history and product line. Seiko, Seiko Prospex, Prospex LX and Grand Seiko. Look at that long catalog under all product lines. Citizen isn't even close. IMO the Citizen in your comparison has a better movement and case. Seiko Shogun Prospex SPB189J1 SPB189J1 SPB189J Titanium Diving Watch doesn't come close to the Citizen Promaster Titanium Diver. The Shogun movement is not comparable. The Shogun build is nice but it worth the extra $/ price difference versus the Citizen. Your own comparison is against Seiko 62MAS models. What was the Citizen dive watch that competed with the original 62MAS watches? The Citizen is the true dive tool in the comparison. Seiko is the dive watch with the history. This is no different from the Swiss brands with long histories. Certina makes a great Titanium dive watch. Certina has some history with their dive products. I would not put that up against the Submariner, 50 Fathoms or Seamaster. The 62MAS will sell like crazy because it's a beautiful, well-built diver from Seiko. Seiko will also sell far more dive watches from all of their product lines. I'll bet non watch nerds would name Seiko long before Citizen when asked about dive watches.

Really? In what way does Seiko have more "cachet" outside of the Watch Enthusiast echo chamber?

To my knowledge Citizen has been more associated with diving than Seiko, among actual divers.

Wall of Text alert!

You're confusing first with best. By your standard Timex is better than Rolex, because Timex was making watches 51 years before Rolex even existed.

Seiko may have been the first Japanese company to make dive watches, but Citizen wasn't too far behind, and they actually had dive watches issued to professional divers. The NY0040 was issued to Italian military divers in the late '90s.

From my understanding, among the dive community, Citizen was more commonly found in dive shops, and on the wrists of divers. I'll admit I wasn't hanging out in dive shops in the '80s/'90s/'00s, but when people that were there say Citizen was more popular, I don't argue.

Your watch community "group think" is showing...

Citizen is a bigger brand, despite the silly points the influencers bring up.

I think these are some really nice looking watches. I've had 3 watches with 6R movements and 2 ran horriby, and the 3rd is barely within Seikos tolerances. I'm taking a Citizen automatic over a Seiko any day until Seiko does something about the 6R. They recenty released the 6R55 and instead of fixing the issues of the 6R35, they just added 2 hours of power reserve. Does the power reserve even matter if the watch will be off by a minute after a day or 2? You're setting the watch again anyways so power reserve is really just a marketing point with little real world application. We know they can do it, they just aren't. I know it's a different price point but I have two Grand Seikos with 70 hours of reserve and they are still within a few seconds of where I set them after 48-70 hours.

You have too many nice watches not to rotate, but if you wear it daily the 6R movements not bad (I have 2), run about +6 to +10 seconds a day for me. If I rotate it with a couple watches then it runs about -15 to -20 seconds a day (terrible but within their stated specs). Though I’ve found if I manual wind every morning on the days I’m not wearing it it’s back to the +6 range.

Yeah I wish it was better too but I really like the look of their divers, more than Citizen.

Yours may be, but thats the thing, it's really a crapshoot. If I wear the Seikos with 6Rs daily, the accurcacy is better, but even wearing my SPB151 and SPB143 for 3-4 days straight the 143 looses about 45-50 seconds a day and the 151 looses about 20-25 seconds a day. If I don't wear them consistently, the accuracy is even worse. My Alpinist with 6R was so bad Seiko agreed to service it and when it came back it was only a little better and way out of spec so I sold it cheap. So you're 2 for 2 with good luck, and I'm 3 for 3 with bad luck on them. There's just no consistency. It's a gamble whether it will run fine or not. I can't think of any other brand that struggles that much with accuracy. I say all of this as a massive Seiko fan. I just wish they did better.

Yeah. That’s terrible, you’re not alone as I’ve read similar experiences. Honestly that’s the reason I’ve not gotten an Alpinist.

Yours may be, but thats the thing, it's really a crapshoot. If I wear the Seikos with 6Rs daily, the accurcacy is better, but even wearing my SPB151 and SPB143 for 3-4 days straight the 143 looses about 45-50 seconds a day and the 151 looses about 20-25 seconds a day. If I don't wear them consistently, the accuracy is even worse. My Alpinist with 6R was so bad Seiko agreed to service it and when it came back it was only a little better and way out of spec so I sold it cheap. So you're 2 for 2 with good luck, and I'm 3 for 3 with bad luck on them. There's just no consistency. It's a gamble whether it will run fine or not. I can't think of any other brand that struggles that much with accuracy. I say all of this as a massive Seiko fan. I just wish they did better.

Please try to get your thoughts sorted next time. This roller coaster ride of a text is nearly impossible to read or follow up on.

Seiko just have a slightly higher profile and are more in vogue. Citizen I think it is agreed on, have better QC and are now a full power house and in a lot of ways better than Seiko(?), but Seiko have done better with the marketing so far, just my opinion.

@TimeJunkie

This man know his Seiko’s. And dive watches. Bravo!👏

This. Seiko ruled the deep in the 60s and 70s, sure, but Citizen caught up to them in the 80s and surpassed it in the 90s IMO especially with their Eco Drive movement.

You'll see a commercial diver walking around with a Seiko for the cachet and brand recognition but you'll see them dive with a Promaster.