A sad day.....
Well I never thought I'd end up feeling this way, I started my watch journey with this brand and I definitely still love their vintage stuff. But sorry seiko your asking too much money for the value were getting. You may want to go up market well thats fine but make watches that live up to that standard with a QC that matches the quality of the price. I think seiko have shot them selves in the foot, especially when citizen can build a similar watch for half the money with better QC. What do people think? I.m not anti seiko as I use to be a seiko fan boy,just interesting to see what people think. Personally I don't think you get value for money and QC is crap.
Old in body young at heart, into motorcycles,mountain biking,hi-fi,80's music rock and metal and obviously watches. Favorite watch brands are seiko and fortis.
My eye is mostly for vintage Seiko watches, so I'm not really bothered by their business decisions
Seiko has their name and they're riding on it. With all of the micro brand options out there now, there's no need for a new seiko. It IS a bit offensive when they use pressed clasps and hardlex on watches over 400 bucks....
Seiko bracelets rattle at all price points. Now Islander watches has some good products to look at. the 26 movement should have been replaced by the 36 years ago. Orient isn't much better being owned by Seiko. The upside is when they quit you just drop in an inexpensive movement for less than cleaning it.
Seiko has their name and they're riding on it. With all of the micro brand options out there now, there's no need for a new seiko. It IS a bit offensive when they use pressed clasps and hardlex on watches over 400 bucks....
Yeh they do like their pressed clasps thats for sure 👍
Seiko bracelets rattle at all price points. Now Islander watches has some good products to look at. the 26 movement should have been replaced by the 36 years ago. Orient isn't much better being owned by Seiko. The upside is when they quit you just drop in an inexpensive movement for less than cleaning it.
Very true 👍
My eye is mostly for vintage Seiko watches, so I'm not really bothered by their business decisions
Yes I definitely like their vintage stuff so well made and top quality. 👍
Just watching this one play out - it’s nothing I’ve not said already, and people wonder why I’m not on the Seiko train.
@Metalguru68 - you have my sympathies. Perhaps a shopping trip on AliExpress or eBay might make you feel better. No pin-levers though…
What got me thinking about seiko's pricing was the cost of some of the seiko 5's some getting close to the 300 pound mark which seems a bit steep, but what finally put the final nail in the coffin was the new solar dive watch which I really liked as it had a 38.5mm case and looked really nice until I saw the price 500+ pounds 😯 what do you get for that? Pressed clasp,hollow end links,quartz solar movement oh but you also get sapphire crystal (big deal). Def not worth the price.
Just for example take a look at the citizen ray mears tough eco drive it has a titanium mono block case, sapphire crystal,ecodrive movement and 300m wr and in my opinion better QC and finishing for £300.
Its a shame seiko have gone this route 😪 i will stick to vintage seiko's now and look elsewhere for new pieces.
Over priced !
Just watching this one play out - it’s nothing I’ve not said already, and people wonder why I’m not on the Seiko train.
@Metalguru68 - you have my sympathies. Perhaps a shopping trip on AliExpress or eBay might make you feel better. No pin-levers though…
Just waiting on the citizen tough to be delivered on Monday thatll cheer me up lol.
Just waiting on the citizen tough to be delivered on Monday thatll cheer me up lol.
There we go.
I'm a big fan of Seiko but I agree, they are in danger of killing the goose that laid the golden egg.
Just waiting on the citizen tough to be delivered on Monday thatll cheer me up lol.
The Citizen 'Ray Mears' is a truly great watch. It looks good, has all the right ingredients and is one of those watches to which 'this is the only watch you need' applies. This is the one I would keep if I had to get rid of the rest of my collection.
I was thinking of getting a "dressier" Seiko, but the Presage line still uses Hardlex for a lot of the watches? Then I was looking at the non compass Alpinist models, but the sizing is still a little big (for me) for what I want.
I got a DressKX (SRPE) new but for a very good price, but for the first time i have already scratched the Hardlex. So it's either sapphire or acrylic (because at least that can be "fixed") going forwards.
Plus the accuracy is mostly just ok. I've been reading good things about the 9000 Miyota movements.
TLDR, probably not going to get another Seiko for a whil, might sell one of my current as well. Looking at the Vaer A30 Atlas.
Just watching this one play out - it’s nothing I’ve not said already, and people wonder why I’m not on the Seiko train.
@Metalguru68 - you have my sympathies. Perhaps a shopping trip on AliExpress or eBay might make you feel better. No pin-levers though…
You and you're pin-levers mate 😂😂😂
I haven't purchased a new Seiko in almost 3 years now, my last was a Marine Master 031 with the hardlex crystal. It was a bargain when I picked it up and I still think it was good value as it's accuracy is amazing, but everything after that, well I've tooted that horn too many times to mention myself.
Such a shame, Seiko used to be great value watches 😭
What got me thinking about seiko's pricing was the cost of some of the seiko 5's some getting close to the 300 pound mark which seems a bit steep, but what finally put the final nail in the coffin was the new solar dive watch which I really liked as it had a 38.5mm case and looked really nice until I saw the price 500+ pounds 😯 what do you get for that? Pressed clasp,hollow end links,quartz solar movement oh but you also get sapphire crystal (big deal). Def not worth the price.
Just for example take a look at the citizen ray mears tough eco drive it has a titanium mono block case, sapphire crystal,ecodrive movement and 300m wr and in my opinion better QC and finishing for £300.
Its a shame seiko have gone this route 😪 i will stick to vintage seiko's now and look elsewhere for new pieces.
Over priced !
You're paying way too much wherever your buying the Seiko's from. In Australia you can find these models for around $400 which would equate to 200 odd pounds, maybe shop on Japanese websites, definitely cheaper than paying nearly 1000 AUD 👍
Seikos aren't the crazy bargains they were but it's not fair to compare them only to Citizen - Citizen is unbeatable. Compared to other horologically significant brands Seiko is still competitive. They are all ripoffs now, sadly (except Citizen).
Citizen pound for pound are the best value watch brand for sure.
Full ack. I rather recommend Orient instead of Seiko. Who buys watches above 200€ and still wants hardlex?
Hardlex is by far the worst crystal you could get. I only buy sapphire or Acryl.
Also I had one seiko5 that cost me like 90€. Sold It 4 years later for 150€. They are too expensive now.
I don't understand why seiko don't fit sapphire it ain't expensive. Orient are very good value.
I agree. Seiko are in a very difficult position. Their low cost watches are under severe pressure from Chinese watch manufacturing - using Seiko movements and cheap Sapphire crystal to deliver specs that are (on paper) better and for less than half the price. Seiko has had no choice but to move upmarket. Have they done it well enough? I don't think so. I hope I'm wrong though.
I’ve no issue with Seiko’s pricing.
I agree. Seiko are in a very difficult position. Their low cost watches are under severe pressure from Chinese watch manufacturing - using Seiko movements and cheap Sapphire crystal to deliver specs that are (on paper) better and for less than half the price. Seiko has had no choice but to move upmarket. Have they done it well enough? I don't think so. I hope I'm wrong though.
I don't think they've done it well enough, they cut corners on cost and their QC is still not quite their in my opinion, the new seiko solar diver I like just shows they are not value for money, yes I understand their position and yes nothing wrong with going up a tier but your watches have to match that price point and seiko watches dont.
It's too bad, but I have found there is always a better choice than Seiko, no matter the criteria. They rest on their laurels, methinks.
It's too bad, but I have found there is always a better choice than Seiko, no matter the criteria. They rest on their laurels, methinks.
Yes I think they do 👍
Seiko still has some good bargains, like the 5s with the 7S26. I'm very happy with my SNXS79. The "DressKX" also seems to offer relatively good value for the money.
As for the rest of the brand... To me, Seiko has lost its identity completely. They spit out one limited edition after another. They also started consistently downgrading their watches while increasing prices. The 6R15 has been phased out in favour of the 4R35 family, which is basically the NH35, only signed by Seiko. Meanwhile, the 6R35-powered models cross into the Longines price range. I know this is going to be an unpopular thing to say, hate me for it all you want, but I think that the 6R35 can at best get its shinebox and give the L888 a shoeshine. Inferior finishing, inferior hairspring, inferior quality control, lower frequency, common issues with performance (Timegrapher snowstorm).
I'd choose the Longines Conquest or a Christopher Ward from their Military series over any Alpinist, even though I do think the Laurel Alpinist is beautiful. I'd choose a Tissot Gentleman over Seiko's Presage Sharp Edge. I'd choose the CW Lympstone or the HydroConquest over the 62MAS reinterpretations. Hell, I'd choose a Glycine Combat SUB over a Seiko automatic diver, 62MAS or any Turtle.
What is really sad is that Seiko used to be the everyman's watch - they were very affordable, and by choosing Seiko you just knew that your watch will be reliable to boot. And now? Same guts as AliExpress and entry level microbrand stuff, notorious alignment issues, more and more cases of poor movement performance, issues like chunks of debris floating around under the crystal.
They pretend to be climbing higher up, while demonstrating complete and utter negligence of quality, downgrading movements... It's like they sacked the QC people and gave the marketing department a solid raise. As a result, it's no longer the everyman's watch. It's a thing you buy if the MSRP is spare change to you, not something worth saving up for. Sorry, but that's not the way to go.
If they actually took care of the QC and priced their watches competitively to pieces of roughly the same tier of quality and performance, I'd like to own another Seiko. Alas, since they seem intent on offering less for more, that won't happen.
Seiko still has some good bargains, like the 5s with the 7S26. I'm very happy with my SNXS79. The "DressKX" also seems to offer relatively good value for the money.
As for the rest of the brand... To me, Seiko has lost its identity completely. They spit out one limited edition after another. They also started consistently downgrading their watches while increasing prices. The 6R15 has been phased out in favour of the 4R35 family, which is basically the NH35, only signed by Seiko. Meanwhile, the 6R35-powered models cross into the Longines price range. I know this is going to be an unpopular thing to say, hate me for it all you want, but I think that the 6R35 can at best get its shinebox and give the L888 a shoeshine. Inferior finishing, inferior hairspring, inferior quality control, lower frequency, common issues with performance (Timegrapher snowstorm).
I'd choose the Longines Conquest or a Christopher Ward from their Military series over any Alpinist, even though I do think the Laurel Alpinist is beautiful. I'd choose a Tissot Gentleman over Seiko's Presage Sharp Edge. I'd choose the CW Lympstone or the HydroConquest over the 62MAS reinterpretations. Hell, I'd choose a Glycine Combat SUB over a Seiko automatic diver, 62MAS or any Turtle.
What is really sad is that Seiko used to be the everyman's watch - they were very affordable, and by choosing Seiko you just knew that your watch will be reliable to boot. And now? Same guts as AliExpress and entry level microbrand stuff, notorious alignment issues, more and more cases of poor movement performance, issues like chunks of debris floating around under the crystal.
They pretend to be climbing higher up, while demonstrating complete and utter negligence of quality, downgrading movements... It's like they sacked the QC people and gave the marketing department a solid raise. As a result, it's no longer the everyman's watch. It's a thing you buy if the MSRP is spare change to you, not something worth saving up for. Sorry, but that's not the way to go.
If they actually took care of the QC and priced their watches competitively to pieces of roughly the same tier of quality and performance, I'd like to own another Seiko. Alas, since they seem intent on offering less for more, that won't happen.
Have to say your pretty much spot on with what your saying. My padi 055 has a 6r15 movement and its pretty much a cheap movement poorly modified and shoved in a £700 pound watch, the movement is very unstable and its been a real pain to get it regulated to somewhere near acceptable.
I really don't understand seiko anymore every mid tier watch and above should come with sapphire crystal,milled clasp and solid end links but they keep cutting corners and their QC is still very hit and miss.
They just can't compete with watches in similar price brackets which being such a large company they should have the buying power to easily compete.
I think alot of people including myself looked at seiko through rose tinted glasses but not any more,they are not the company they use to be and I for one will not buy another mid tier or higher seiko again! So many companies out there selling watches for the same money but superior in build,QC and movement.
Hopefully seiko will wake up and change their ways but I can't see that happening anytime soon 😪
I really can't argue with a word of the OP's writing. Not only what he noted - the brand has pretty much screwed up the Seiko 5 line and simply discontinued many of their most popular models.
Rear view mirror as far as I'm concerned. Why have to do a QC and CS crapshoot? At THOSE prices?
I really can't argue with a word of the OP's writing. Not only what he noted - the brand has pretty much screwed up the Seiko 5 line and simply discontinued many of their most popular models.
Rear view mirror as far as I'm concerned. Why have to do a QC and CS crapshoot? At THOSE prices?
Def,think they've screwed up big time..
Seiko is dead to me. DEAD.
Seiko is dead to me. DEAD.
Yep don't think I will buy another new seiko again, maybe the odd vintage one may come my way 👍
Even more amusing is that Orient, which falls under the Seiko-Epson umbrella, has impeccable finishing and QC and punches way above their weight.
Even more amusing is that Orient, which falls under the Seiko-Epson umbrella, has impeccable finishing and QC and punches way above their weight.
That is very true I've had a couple of orient and they've all be very good,well built and value for money. Maybe because Epson seiko are separate from seiko they do things properly 👍