Pagani vs. Scurfa & Squale: can the clone hold its own against other affordable automatic dive watches?
*** beware, somehwat longish read - skip to the end for the conclusion if you want ***
My first clone / clomage watch, whatever you want to call it, arrived yesterday. It’s the Pagani Design 1661, which takes all of its design cues from the Rolex Submariner. Now, first off, this is not a so-called ‘placeholder’ because I have no intention of owning a Submariner. I DO like the design and in all honesty I was curious about the quality of such a watch. I’ve seen it praised on this forum (mostly) and bashed (sometimes) so thought, as part of the watch collecting learning process: let’s try it out!
Since I own two other affordable dive watches (also automatics), I’ll pit the Pagani against them and see how it holds up. The two challengees are:
Scurfa Treasure Seeker (retailing at around EUR 450, so around 3.5x the cost of the Pagani)
Squale 1545 (retailing at around EUR 800, so a bit more than 6x the cost of the Pagani)
Review items are case, case back, bezel, glass, crown, dial incl. date window, lume, movement, strap and overall wearability. No time or equipment atm for measuring accuracy or WR 🙂 Regarding WR: the Pagani is rated at 100m, the Scurfa and Squale at 300m. Since my diving is limited to surface swimming, not a real factor for me.
Case
Not much to differentiate here, all stainless steel (Scurfa and Squale 316L, Pagani: unknown), well finished and with a hefty feel to it.
Winner: TIE
Case back
The Pagani proudly shows its Seiko movement, protected by sapphire glass. Nice, but I don’t really need an exhibition case back on a diver (and the NH35 is not that special). The Squale has a fairly minimally decorated case back; it’s nice but nothing special. The Scurfa takes the prize here, for a great looking embossed diver-seeking-treasure-scene.
Winner: Scurfa
Bezel
All three watches have ceramic bezels. The bezel action on the Pagani is smooth; it’s easy to rotate, just enough resistance, good grip. There IS a bit of play though. No such thing on the Scurfa or Squale. The Squale however has a slight alignment issue, so therefore:
Winner: Scurfa
* word of warning here to potential Pagani buyers: the bezel on my model does not look like the advertisement at all. For me, that’s lucky: i think the matt grey bezel, with the black applied indices looks fantastic - and I don’t need the legibility. If you expect a legible bezel with bright white lettering though, you’ll be disappointed!
Glass
The Scurfa sports a blue anti reflective coating on the underside of the sapphire glass, as does the Squale. Can’t find in the specs whether the Pagani’s synthetic sapphire is AR treated, but just by looking at it, I would say it is.
Winner: TIE
Crown action
All fairly standard screw-in action and quick date setting. The pushing/screwing-in action is just a little bit easier with the Scurfa. The Pagani and Squale do sometimes require multiple ‘push-ins’ before they can be properly screwed in.
Winner: Scurfa
Dial
All three watches have applied indices in a similar style and all three have something specific that makes them stand out. For the Scurfa it’s the (bright yellow :) honeycomb pattern, for the Pagani it’s the dark blue gradient effect and for the Squale it is the unique grey-blue color and the red details.
Winner: TIE
Date window
The cyclops on the Pagani actually works really well. I’ve commented before on silly little date windows (another reason I love my GO with panorama date so much :), but at least on the Pagani the 2.5x magnification makes the date easily legible. The windows on the Scurfa and Squale are the silly little ones.
Winner: Pagani
Lume
The lime on the Pagani is good enough (albeit a somewhat unfriendly shade of blue, i prefer a more greener tint); see below. The Squale is also decent, but the Scurfa tops them by quite a margin
Winner: Scurfa
(from left to right: Scurfa, Pagani, Squale)
Movement
Can’t really comment on the intrinsic quality of the respective movements used; I did find the difference in noise noticeable though: the Seiko NH35 (21,600 bph) in the Pagani and the Sellita SW 200-1 (28,800 bph) in the Squale, when held to the ear, make a distinct ticking noise, the Myota 9015 (28,800 bph) in the Scurfa is completely quiet.
Winner: Scurfa
Strap
Scurfa loses out here - the strap is unadorned, does not taper and is not very flexible. It’s a functional strap for sure, but the tropic on the Squale and the ridged strap on the Pagani are better looking and more comfortable. And the Pagani’s even features quick release.
Winner: Pagani
Wearability
How does it look on the wrist and how comfortable is it to wear? Due to the stiffer strap and the fact the Scurfa had a tendency to press into my hand/wrist when cycling, it’s between the Squale and the Pagani. The Squale just nudges ahead here - you don’t notice it on your wrist it’s so comfortable, the dial and strap are very well color-coordinated and the lack of the cyclops window makes it look good under any angle.
Winner: Squale
CONCLUSION
So, can the Pagani Design 1661 compete with its diver brethren, the Scurfa Treasure Seeker and the Squale 1545? Looking at the numbers (3 ties, 5 wins for Scurfa, 2 for Pagani, 1 for the Squale (but in a very important category!) and having worn it for a bit now: yes, it certainly can. It’s not better (I think the Scurfa is the better allround watch and the Squale can be worn anytime, anywhere without a hint of discomfort) but it is amazing how much you get for a little over one hundred bucks. And as a bonus, it looks like no other Sub with its dark blue gradient dial and the black numerals on the bezel! The only real negative for me is the quality of the bezel, which really should be sturdier. But other than that, I can see where @Mr.Dee.Bater is coming from - PD offers a lot of bang for the buck!
Quite new to the world of watches...but looking forward to learn more about it.
I think you ended up getting the Rolex Yacht Master homage!
Great write up!
I just picked up a 1662 Pepsi from AliExpress. Got it real cheap too!
I think you ended up getting the Rolex Yacht Master homage!
Great write up!
Lol...I think you're right! Ah well, glad I did :-)
I just picked up a 1662 Pepsi from AliExpress. Got it real cheap too!
Im sorry, but why don't you save money and get a real Rolex instead of a fake with which you lie to yourself and everyone else who sees the watch
Thanks for the in-depth review! It's always super interesting to read about how these cheap Chinese homages fare when compared to big brands worth several hundreds if not thousands. It really puts things into perspective... 🙏
My first mod on my SKX was to replace the bezel insert with a Yacht Master style insert similar to your Pagani. I liked the big numerals a lot but I was quite disappointed after making the swap. It looks great in pictures with just the right lighting conditions, but in reality, it lacks contrast and it's not very legible as you pointed out. I ended up changing the bezel again after a couple weeks, this time for a Marine Master one.
Im sorry, but why don't you save money and get a real Rolex instead of a fake with which you lie to yourself and everyone else who sees the watch
Because I dgaf what anyone thinks, I have a YouTube channel where I can talk about the watch and my most popular videos have been about watches I picked up from AliExpress. I'm also learning to tear down watches and service them and this would be a good one to work on.
I just picked up a 1662 Pepsi from AliExpress. Got it real cheap too!
I was going to reply to this troll comment...
... with
But, decided not to fan the flames. Angry people gonna be angry and unhappy. Why feed the trolls???
I was going to reply to this troll comment...
... with
But, decided not to fan the flames. Angry people gonna be angry and unhappy. Why feed the trolls???
https://youtu.be/k5mf--eUmBA there are no watch snobs
I would remove the PD from this comparsion and put in something like Deep Blue or Glycine. It's more apples to apples.
Well, looking at the lume shot I would say the Squale wins the whole debate easily. The pip is really important to see underwater, the other 2watches don't even have one. A diver a has a pip, if it doesn't it is not a diver. The whole point of a diver is to see the time underwater.
Well, looking at the lume shot I would say the Squale wins the whole debate easily. The pip is really important to see underwater, the other 2watches don't even have one. A diver a has a pip, if it doesn't it is not a diver. The whole point of a diver is to see the time underwater.
Absolutely fair point. And should have spotted it myself - as the Scurfa is designed and produced by a professional diver — and he would not have left the pip unlumed!
I made an awkward mistake - and used a lume shot of a CW C63 by mistake 😬Below is the Scurfa proper:
Will edit the post - thanks for spotting this!
Absolutely fair point. And should have spotted it myself - as the Scurfa is designed and produced by a professional diver — and he would not have left the pip unlumed!
I made an awkward mistake - and used a lume shot of a CW C63 by mistake 😬Below is the Scurfa proper:
Will edit the post - thanks for spotting this!
That looks like the business... So scurfa you say... I'ma check them out
That looks like the business... So scurfa you say... I'ma check them out
Check https://www.scurfawatches.com/ The Ones are hard to come by, the Treasure Seeker is more readily available. Have edited the post btw, now showing the correct lume shot! And as Mr.Dee.Bater pointed out, seems PD have done more of a yacht master than a sub homage with my watch, which could explain the missing lumed pip...but know very little about the Rolex collection, so don't know whether the original YM has this or not..
I was going to reply to this troll comment...
... with
But, decided not to fan the flames. Angry people gonna be angry and unhappy. Why feed the trolls???
I think you don't understand my point. I don't care what preferences you have and how much you spend on which watch. But if you don't have enough money to wear a Rolex then you have to accept that and settle for a cheap Casio or Seiko. I would also like to make it clear that I personally do not have anything against cheap watches and sometimes wear a 30 euro casio myself, but buying a 1 to 1 fake watch that is only there to look like a real one from afar is really embarrassing. If you can't afford or WANT to afford the Rolex design then you shouldn't wear it.
I think you don't understand my point. I don't care what preferences you have and how much you spend on which watch. But if you don't have enough money to wear a Rolex then you have to accept that and settle for a cheap Casio or Seiko. I would also like to make it clear that I personally do not have anything against cheap watches and sometimes wear a 30 euro casio myself, but buying a 1 to 1 fake watch that is only there to look like a real one from afar is really embarrassing. If you can't afford or WANT to afford the Rolex design then you shouldn't wear it.
I do not get what you’re saying. On the one hand you “don’t care what preferences you have and how much spend on a watch”. OK, fine - live and let live. But you end with: “If you can't afford or WANT to afford the Rolex design then you shouldn't wear it.” I honestly don’t get that. I do not want to spend a lot of money on a Rolex. I want to spend that money on a GO, which I find much, much more to my liking. I can appreciate the Rolex Yacht Master design - so if a company like Pagani offers me a very decent watch for a 100 bucks in that design, why should I not wear it? I think you’re projecting here: I think you would be embarrassed if someone spotted a clone on your wrist and you’d feel like a fraud, an imposter or something. I do not. I’d love to have a conversation about the fake Rolex on my wrist. And advance warning: a Pagani Speedmaster is on its way ;-) Happy collecting!
I do not get what you’re saying. On the one hand you “don’t care what preferences you have and how much spend on a watch”. OK, fine - live and let live. But you end with: “If you can't afford or WANT to afford the Rolex design then you shouldn't wear it.” I honestly don’t get that. I do not want to spend a lot of money on a Rolex. I want to spend that money on a GO, which I find much, much more to my liking. I can appreciate the Rolex Yacht Master design - so if a company like Pagani offers me a very decent watch for a 100 bucks in that design, why should I not wear it? I think you’re projecting here: I think you would be embarrassed if someone spotted a clone on your wrist and you’d feel like a fraud, an imposter or something. I do not. I’d love to have a conversation about the fake Rolex on my wrist. And advance warning: a Pagani Speedmaster is on its way ;-) Happy collecting!
If you can live with people laughing at you because of your fake watch, then that's okay, but Paganini Design steals the designs from Rolex and then resells them for 100 euros, of course this pisses me off and every other Rolex owner. Why can't you cope with wearing a Seiko or Casio? Why do you have to buy a fake Rolex? Come on with the fact that you can't afford the design. There are so many beautiful cheap watches on the market, why does it have to be a fake Rolex?
If you can live with people laughing at you because of your fake watch, then that's okay, but Paganini Design steals the designs from Rolex and then resells them for 100 euros, of course this pisses me off and every other Rolex owner. Why can't you cope with wearing a Seiko or Casio? Why do you have to buy a fake Rolex? Come on with the fact that you can't afford the design. There are so many beautiful cheap watches on the market, why does it have to be a fake Rolex?
Last thing I'll say on this: I think your life would be a lot easier if you'd stick to your initial premiss, i.e. 'don’t care what preferences you have and how much you spend on a watch'. Give it a try, see how it works out for you 👍