San Martin Watches. Respectable or Deplorable?

Love what they're doing.  At some point, hopefully, they'll prove - if they haven't already - that their watches are just as reliable and robust as anything coming out of Switzerland or Japan, and then we'll all have even more choice available to us!

So I am getting ready to collect my thoughts on my new San Martin so that I can do a proper review of it on WC, but I am not quite 100% ready since I’ve only had the watch for 6 days. 
In the short while I’ve had it, I will say I would definitely buy another San Martin, just not the one I got. 
 

I won’t go crazy with photos, but this gives you the idea. It’s a Datejust homage on a “presidential“ bracelet. PT5000 movement, sapphire crystal, the usual San Martin specs.

Pros: Cheap for what you get, excellent finishing, bracelet quality amazing.  Pretty much anything to do with materials and assembly is better than par. 
 

Cons of my watch: handwinding mechanism feels very scary (won’t be using it much, or at all anyways), crown is small as hell and I have small hands and fingers, so far movement accuracy has been on the bad side of the allowable tolerances. In just 6 days my watch was about 3 minutes slow (I don’t really care about this but I know some will)

Overall, I do think they are a little hyped up on YouTube (cough cough JOMW), but it can depend on the model you get. Mine was just a bit pricier compared to some other popular models. Being 100% honest—the bracelet was what led me to buy the watch, along with the bezel design. I love the contrast of the finishing on the presidential bracelet and I could stare at the fluted bezel all day long. 

See anything coming from the house of Pagani or Steinhart - homages have their place in the hobby, and if introduces/gets folks to  wear more watches than even better 🤙

I would also like to add one more genuine con.  I don’t need San Martin to do the meters to feet conversion for me right on the middle of the dial. Looks a bit dumb. That is truly my only gripe about the design. 

Yes, the long term results of what San Martin is doing with be extremely interesting to see.  Who knows maybe in 5 years we will have a sub-$300 perpetual triple calendar and moon phase in an original design by San Martin.

I exaggerate a bit, but I could see these Chinese brands really starting to dig into the big companies‘ profits once they get some good original designs together.  Probably not enough to shutter Seiko or Orient, but enough to really give them a headache.  

I was browsing their site the other day and was pleasantly surprised that they actually denote their original designs now to separate from their homage designs. Also, watches like their Damascus steel watch and other upper end designs are now available with Sellita SW200s

San Martin + Miyota 9075 = ❤

If I were them, I'd hire a designer who is a watch geek and a good search engine/instagram marketer.  They'd put half  the microbrands in the space out of business in a heartbeat.

I've worked with Chinese businesses in China...  that's like asking a dog to eat soup with a spoon!

"Pay for design?  What?  I can do the logo myself!"

I have only heard good things San Martin, the prices are attractive but selling through Ali Express makes you question what your getting.

All things Aliexpress are a crapshoot for warranty and service. The Only thing good about the Chinese watches are  the Japanese parts in them.

Great watch, buy direct from San Martin or Watchdive and avoid the Ali Express drama.

But their designs would be immediately copied by other Chinese brands ...

I guess they are neither... They make good quality for an affordable price but steal designs all the way. I don't wouldn't wear them but I try to avoid anything that supports the CCP as far as that's possible.

I recently bought a San Martin 6200:

The fit, finish, and polishing matches anything I've seen in the $300 to $500 street price space. The finish on mine gleams and glistens. Its negatives are that the shiny side plates on the bracelet are sharp/rough, and resizing the bracelet with dual screwdrivers is a PITA. (Resizing tip: Use full sized jewelers screwdrivers rather than the stubby bundled set. The bundled blades are too thin to stay in the slots too.) 

Yes, it's a Rolex/Tudor homage, and yes they are just stuffing a movement in a case, and yes they are using the same parts bin crystals, hands, etc. that other Chinese makers use. But, "Swiss Made" means 60% of the cost comes from Switzerland, so many Swiss makers may be using those same parts and case builders, and same polishing staff.

San Martin has put a great deal of effort into promoting the brand (e.g., paid reviews through JOMW and ILW). This hasn't yet resulted in Invicta-like pricing (yet). My 6200 was less than $200, but it's likely the loss leader model used to suck people into the brand and to try higher priced models. At this point you are getting what you pay for: parts bin parts with better fit and finish than most Chinese competitors. 

National quality images change slowly then all at once. San Martin is probably farther ahead than Japan was in the 1960s -- as Nikon, Canon, Sony, Honda, Toyota, Nissan (Datsun), Panasonic, Seiko, etc. moved the country's reputation upscale. Before that Japan was known for rice paper decorations and cheap pressed metal toys. "Little Honda" was a 1964 novelty song. Similarly, The Clash sang in 1980: 

"Gimme Honda, gimme Sony
So cheap and real phony"

https://songmeanings.com/songs/view/3530822107859340378/

From a quality/value standpoint my San Martin 6200 competes very, very well with Seiko, Orient, Citizen, and the cheaper (Swatch family) Swiss brands. They are likely trying to move beyond homages  and break away from the AliExpress fake/knock-off image.  I'm not sure if that'll be possible in the crowded and ruthlessly competitive watch market. 

If it's Chinese it has no place with me. Can't support the CCP.

Or Russian or well actually quite a few places I wouldn't entertain.

They are perfectly good for what they are. I’ve been using the Explorer homage in Turquoise as a holiday beater. Solid. Keeps good time. The crew down crown and winding is nowhere near my proper Explorer but it’s cheaper than a MoonSwatch. What do you expect for that money?

Woah... Calm down... I think that wanting to support basic human rights is a little beyond common politics? And I said it was my choice and said that it was somewhat possible despite common belief. That's all ☺️ 

I am very interested in San Martin watches. I am pretty sure that I will end up getting one or two of them, just have to figure out which one(s).

The datejust homages look very nice and I would like to try the custom logo option, especially if I can combine it with their applied logo. Not really too keen on the font they use below the center. I think I will try the two-tone or the all steel/white/silver one.

I wish that I really liked one of their original designs.

I spend an inordinate amount of time gawking at San Martin watches on their website.

I'm not a fan of homages to currently produced watches, San Martin included. However, copying a long-discontinued design is nothing wrong in my book. When Steinhart does it, no one bats an eye, when the Chinese do, suddenly it's an outrage. 

They're also starting to do original designs, kudos to them for that. 

Hell, I'd actually love to have that homage to the 1016 Explorer. Would make a cool beater. But...

But I'm not sure I wanna buy Chinese. Well, it's hard not to buy Chinese anyway, but somehow it eases my mind when I buy non-Chinese, or at least when I think what I'm buying ain't Chinese. In February and March, I've done some volunteer work helping war refugees from Ukraine. Knowing that China did and still does openly trade with Russia, I just can't quite get myself to buy any Chinese watch, not that some of them aren't tempting. Similarly, I have a hard time wearing my Vostok Amfibia now. 

Buying a San Martin or not buying probably won't change squat in a wider perspective. However, since I'm broke most of the time, I reckon it became a non-issue to me anyway.

I was going to build my own Seamaster 300 homage based on a NH35 movement. This project was on the backburner when I came across San Martin and the SN051-G was on sale. For most part I couldn't have built it any cheaper. So I said, "Why not?". Got the watch, I'm happy with it and it's a great throw around watch. 

For now, it serves as a placeholder until I can pickup the real McCoy (if prices keep falling like they are, it may be sooner than later.)

You really think many of this Swiss brands are manufacturing (not design) their own watch boxes? manuals, warranty cards?   

This is an article I read a while back:

"Many Swiss brands use only parts made in Switzerland, sometimes in the same village as the brand factory. But it is an open secret in the watch industry that others purchase bracelets, movements, cases, crowns or hands from suppliers, primarily in China."

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/06/10/fashion/watches-supply-chain-coronavirus-China-Switzerland.html#:~:text=Many%20Swiss%20brands%20use%20only,from%20suppliers%2C%20primarily%20in%20China.

LOL MVMT. Now that was a Aliexpress brand that for some reason got bought by Movado.

I think calling these watches homages is crazy. An homage is inspired by or pays tribute to something else. These are shameless copies.

Ive used homages as a placeholder too.  Bought a pagani AT and it was really very well made. Later got the AT 

Deplorable. Shameful.

They're not worth the time I'm giving writing this comment.
Promises of refund or compensation for shipping/service or sub-par quality, are never honored.
The quality, way of construction, and how they do repairs/service is disgusting.

Looks really good. But the 3 minutes slow is quite disappointing for the price. I have been wearing my $100 NH35 pagani for about 10 days now and it just 30 seconds slow. 

A total lack of design inspiration. 

I think this would look awesome on a bracelet