Why I Still Love Seiko

Yes Seiko has in some ways lost it's status as the king of value in the past couple years, their bracelets suck, their movements are meh, their move upmarket has been detested by enthusiasts.

But my counter argument is that Seiko was traditionally underpriced and they are just becoming confident enough to price their watches like the Swiss (Hamilton/Longines/Tissot). There's still plenty of value to be found in entry level Seikos, they are not crazy value like just a few years ago (e.g. SARB), but I still love my Seikos.

*I know people are gonna bring up citizen, but I've just not been drawn to citizen design and don't feel they are fun/daring to my eyes.

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i dont know about middle tier seiko. but most of the new seiko 5 lines are bang  for bucks for me (except those 5kx anime collab😂)

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Unholy

i dont know about middle tier seiko. but most of the new seiko 5 lines are bang  for bucks for me (except those 5kx anime collab😂)

I think the middle tier is where they struggle. Many offerings in the Prospex line seem stuck in no man's land. 

Agreed that Seiko 5 remains fun and great value 👌

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Being pretty new to the watch world, and having missed out on the golden years of bargain Seiko, they don't seem any worse than the rest of the watch market to me. My collection is currently dominated by Seiko because of the variety and fun they offer at still relatively affordable prices.

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gbelleh

Being pretty new to the watch world, and having missed out on the golden years of bargain Seiko, they don't seem any worse than the rest of the watch market to me. My collection is currently dominated by Seiko because of the variety and fun they offer at still relatively affordable prices.

Yeah exactly. It used to be that swiss watches couldn't hold a candle to the value of Seikos at similar prices. Now they seem to be on the same playing field and more competing on design.

Of course if you are used to the old standards, seiko is "losing it's way", but for someone new coming in, pricing seems fair.

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gbelleh

Being pretty new to the watch world, and having missed out on the golden years of bargain Seiko, they don't seem any worse than the rest of the watch market to me. My collection is currently dominated by Seiko because of the variety and fun they offer at still relatively affordable prices.

Listen, I'm old enough to remember the golden years.  Back then, parents were allowed to slap their children in public.  We didn't wear no seatbelts, because who needs seatbelts!  There was no Internet, because the Internet is evil - we would sit around, bored out of our eff'ing skulls all day long, waiting for Gilligan's Island reruns to come on one of the 3 channels on our 10" state of the art color TV...  as nature intended.

And, back then, we all knew how to dress fashionably.

80'S Fashion GIF - 80s - Discover & Share GIFs
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Mr.Dee.Bater

Listen, I'm old enough to remember the golden years.  Back then, parents were allowed to slap their children in public.  We didn't wear no seatbelts, because who needs seatbelts!  There was no Internet, because the Internet is evil - we would sit around, bored out of our eff'ing skulls all day long, waiting for Gilligan's Island reruns to come on one of the 3 channels on our 10" state of the art color TV...  as nature intended.

And, back then, we all knew how to dress fashionably.

80'S Fashion GIF - 80s - Discover & Share GIFs

Haha, at the current rate, these styles are gonna be back by summer 🤣

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In the 70s the Japanese were where the Chinese are now. But now they are on par with the Swiss. Seiko has par offerings in all the high volume price ranges. The Japanese drove the US out of the watch market and the car market. They almost did the same to the Swiss with the quartz.

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Mr.Dee.Bater

Listen, I'm old enough to remember the golden years.  Back then, parents were allowed to slap their children in public.  We didn't wear no seatbelts, because who needs seatbelts!  There was no Internet, because the Internet is evil - we would sit around, bored out of our eff'ing skulls all day long, waiting for Gilligan's Island reruns to come on one of the 3 channels on our 10" state of the art color TV...  as nature intended.

And, back then, we all knew how to dress fashionably.

80'S Fashion GIF - 80s - Discover & Share GIFs

I remember those golden years. I remember watching MTV through a wired push button cable box on a 12”black and white TV while wearing knee high striped tube socks. I just wasn’t into Seikos back then.  

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Max

I think the middle tier is where they struggle. Many offerings in the Prospex line seem stuck in no man's land. 

Agreed that Seiko 5 remains fun and great value 👌

Exactly that. GS is great, and the Seiko 5s are just pure fun.

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@Metalguru68 

Now fight!

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Seiko is still a strong value proposition in my book. Not perfect but still a really good offer 🙂

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I've never understood the Seiko love... the designs are not my cup of tea, and as mentioned by others the mid-tier stuff is outclassed by its Swiss competition. 

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Except seiko 5, all their watches should have sapphire crystal. 

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They do make some of the best dials thats for sure 👍 

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Scooby

@Metalguru68 

Now fight!

Can't be bothered im tired lol. Don't hate seiko just i think they've priced themselves too high now.

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We value things differently. We all have our own personal requirements and preferences, checklists and criteria when deciding which time piece to get. The community can offer insight, but end of the day, you are the one who decides. You will be the one who will be looking at the watch you bought. So, what may be valuable for you, may not be so important to others; and vice versa. To each his own. Watch collecting is a personal thing. 

So, whatever opinion or complaint we may have of Seiko, here are my two pesos worth of questions/ things worth considering:

  1. Have you ever actually manufactured a watch? Have you ever put up your own company and brand, and gone through the rigors, and challenges of actually manufacturing and producing a single time piece? Arm chair management has always been frowned on. 
  2. Have you actually been part of Seiko? Have you actually worked in their company, and factories, and seen the vast intricacies of manufacturing, distributing, selling, putting up AD stores, etc.? Have you actually faced the challenges and opportunities they faced? Have you walked a mile in their moccasins? It's so easy to see a black dot in a white piece of paper.  
  3. Have you actually considered that your more favored brand/s (insert brand names here) also have their own set of design flaws, customer gripes and complaints, issues and challenges? Have you ever considered that your favored brand actually also got stuck in time, or got stuck in a rut, or failed to innovate and think out of the box, and refused to take risks? Have you considered that not many people actually like your favored brand? We all have our own confirmation bias.

4. Take Action: If you are serious about your gripes re. any brand, then do something about it. Send them an official letter, and follow through until someone actually speaks to you, and takes action on the point you made -- whether it's a mass producing watch maker, or a luxury brand.  

Ok time to sleep now as it's already past midnight here.     

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OldSnafu

In the 70s the Japanese were where the Chinese are now. But now they are on par with the Swiss. Seiko has par offerings in all the high volume price ranges. The Japanese drove the US out of the watch market and the car market. They almost did the same to the Swiss with the quartz.

Does that mean that we should start looking into chinese brands to hopefully find the next Seiko?

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All the best chinese watches that are getting good reviews are powered by Seiko or Miyota. the Sea-gull chrono is the exception powered by a swiss clone movement. They are slowly bringing their game up to speed

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Seiko has history for sure, but their design language doesn't speak to me and I think that they don't have the strong brand ID like other swiss brands. Omega, Cartier and Tissot recently have outdone themselves with their marketing. Their message is clear and they know what their audiences want and they give it to them. 

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Mr.Dee.Bater

Listen, I'm old enough to remember the golden years.  Back then, parents were allowed to slap their children in public.  We didn't wear no seatbelts, because who needs seatbelts!  There was no Internet, because the Internet is evil - we would sit around, bored out of our eff'ing skulls all day long, waiting for Gilligan's Island reruns to come on one of the 3 channels on our 10" state of the art color TV...  as nature intended.

And, back then, we all knew how to dress fashionably.

80'S Fashion GIF - 80s - Discover & Share GIFs

Spoken like a true Gen X! 😂 

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gbelleh

I remember those golden years. I remember watching MTV through a wired push button cable box on a 12”black and white TV while wearing knee high striped tube socks. I just wasn’t into Seikos back then.  

I was born in the 60's and remember only to well the things you mentioned. Purchased my first Seiko in the 70's for about $35 AUD, which I still have.

With Seiko trying to go up market it's only the guys who started out collecting 10 or so years ago that remember the affordable Seiko's and are a bit disgruntled about their current price increases, all the newer collectors just except these prices as the norm.

I don't think their price hikes are unreasonable given the value of the dollar these days and the increase in wages, manufacturing costs ect, the only thing I have an exception to is their quality control just sucks to put in bluntly.

This wont stop me looking at Seiko's and on occasions buying another for the collection. I purchased one of the first Marine Master 300m with the hardlex crystals because of it's spec's also it's accuracy and for what I paid I have't been disappointed. It all comes down to the value proposition the watch offers and whether you can forgive their QC issues, if any with what you buy.

Just my opinion of course.   

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My first “real” watch was an Orange monster (gen 1) and then a SARB bought at Yodobashi Umeda on my firs to trip to Japan.  
Still have both!  With those origins I’ll always be a fan, despite the escalating prices.   

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SavySeiko

I wish I had that Worn and Wound watch you have. New to watches, seen that and wanted it, but they were all sold out.  

Seiko pricing seems fair to me.  A Hammilton field watch is still twice or three times the money.

There are a bunch available on ebay.  Yeah, not for what they originally sold, but maybe 100 bucks more.  That's how I got mine.  I went back and forth on getting it and waited too long.  

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Weedle

Does that mean that we should start looking into chinese brands to hopefully find the next Seiko?

No. That ship has sailed. The 'next Seiko' is probably an app developer, or Li cell manufactirer, or whatever. That period of watch development will not be repeated.

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I think that the parent company will use Orient to fill the gap created by Seiko moving up. We've seen it with the Orient divers and I expect more "upgraded" models in our other categories.

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kznszn

So who's the King of Value in today's world. I agree with you in terms of citizen not really speaking to me in terms of overall design or just having a catalogue to grow fond of. That being said, it todays world. Does the King of Value go to one simple answer- "Micro brands" or is there another King of Value of a well known brand. If not, Seiko would still hold that title ?

Surely the king of value in this area has to be Orient? A raft of great dive watches, the bambino range ,defenders etc as well as all the Orient Star pieces! Plenty of quality options at good prices.

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I don't hate Seiko, I'm just disappointed in their decisions over the last few years. I love their classic divers, but all the reissues are limited, or crazy prices (imo), but that's just my subjective opinion and I know that may not be an issue for others.

The one thing that really booted me in the nuts is that all they had to do was rerelease the SKX007 with a 4R36 and maybe even 'upgraded' it to a Prospex dial and I would have been happy, but no, they discontinued it and made the case less watertight with a non-screwdown crown and put out a ton of random 'modder' style designs. Again, this is taste and personal preference, I know, but that comined with the 'expensive' reissues soured me on Seiko. 

I await their return to grace and greatness! 😂

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I started my journey with the Seiko SNK089 being my first ever mechanical watch, then quickly moved into Swiss and German brands. I rocked a couple Hamiltons, then moved "up" to rocking a couple of Sinn's, then ultimately took the plunge for the Tudor BB58. I've now come full circle and have pretty much sold every Swiss and German watch for Seikos/Grand Seikos. The design language just "speaks" to me. I've been fortunate to handle multiple Seiko SLA divers now and am floored by the quality when compared to my previous BB58 or even the Omega SMP. Even my SPB187 has some "magic" to it. Long story short I guess... Seiko has stolen my heart even after handling/owning similarly priced Swiss and German offerings. 

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The thing with Seiko is that they are accessible to all, they also produce high end models which rival most Swiss offerings, did I mention Spring Drive which no one else has managed, their divers in particular have cult following, not sure if any Swiss brands in the same price bracket will ever be able to say that, even some of their lower priced models actually increase in value, I don’t see that in Swiss brands…… all in all you can’t go wrong. Now before all the Swiss acolytes start having a pop…. Yes I do own some Swiss watches, a Rolex, and a Doxa but I include Seiko and Orient in my collection as equals not as inferior pieces.

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kentuckyman30

I started my journey with the Seiko SNK089 being my first ever mechanical watch, then quickly moved into Swiss and German brands. I rocked a couple Hamiltons, then moved "up" to rocking a couple of Sinn's, then ultimately took the plunge for the Tudor BB58. I've now come full circle and have pretty much sold every Swiss and German watch for Seikos/Grand Seikos. The design language just "speaks" to me. I've been fortunate to handle multiple Seiko SLA divers now and am floored by the quality when compared to my previous BB58 or even the Omega SMP. Even my SPB187 has some "magic" to it. Long story short I guess... Seiko has stolen my heart even after handling/owning similarly priced Swiss and German offerings. 

I just like Seiko’s designs better as well.  It has nothing to do with cost or value.  My SNK-800’s look close to as good or just as good as Hamilto’s awesome field watches.  My SRPE51 (dressKX). Looks like a Tudor black bay, but the case shape and crown position make it look better in my opinion.  And I just purchase the blue and green Tortoise models, they are so cool looking and unique, who else has a design like this?  Lots of people bitch because Seiko is no longer giving their watches away.  And they say there is better value els ware.  They maybe right, but else ware does not have the awesome design like Seiko.